I've been away for a while, its cos i've been feeling out of it, probably was the last chapter, didn't like it much, anyways i don't mind Gajeel being the ISD, i just have a problem with how it was achieved.

I'll get to that but i just wanna ask express my theory on something i think a lot of people might be mistaken about. Just how much of a power-up is the LFD??. The LFD is weaker now??. Is LFD still a power-up? Erza is stronger than the LFD??.

Now what exactly is the LFD, the Lightning Flame Dragon, a state achieved when natsu took in Lightning based magic. and fuses Lightning and Flames. If Natsu achieved the LFD by eating laxus magic, then why didn't he achieve something similar when he ate etherion or Jellal's magic??
The logic answer is, Etherion is simply a mass of etherano so its reasonable it'd just give him a massive power boost in his own element. becoming a Fire Dragon force, and in Jellal's case, He converted all of his magic power into the Fire magic, flame of rebuke, so this plus natsu's magic power tool him to Fire Dragon force level again. But laxus's was different, he gave natsu his magic power not in form of etherano or fire but in form of lightning so Natsu was able to use lightning magic, and basic this was still magic power in the sense, the magic power was able to permit Natsu his inherent magic, Fire, hence the lightning flame magic. Now thats how it works

Why does it work?
Normally we know that when DS eat elements not typically their own, they get sick. So why was natsu able to eat lightning and not get sick immediately, or more recently Gajeel able to eat without getting sick.

@reefa suggested that when they are weak they can imbue other elements, it could be true, but here's what i think. Two magic powers can't exist in one container, that is what causes the immediate sickness.
Let me explain, It was said that natsu became sick the instant he ate laxus's lightning in one of their fights, at the fight it is possible that Natsu had his magic, lets call it NMp, so he had NMp in him, then he ate laxus's attack made of LMp, so in his container, NMp and LMp together causes him to be sick, but when he ate laxus's lightning against Hades, he was out of Magic power so NMp = 0 at that point, then Laxus gave him his magic power LMp, so in his container, we have only LMp, now this LMp naturally allows for lightning magic, so Natsu can use lightning, but the LMp is still magic power, and Natsu's body is trained or made to convert Mp to fire, so the LMp also allows for his fire ability, Hence an LFD without getting sick, but it was shown that he got sick later when he fell but its technically not being sick since he was up not long later. The etherion one, is simply him eating etherano, thats not a problem, because all the magics have been merged together to etherano, but he later felt the effects because his body would have later broken them down and stuff. Thats for why he doesn't get sick in the LFD, i.e why it works

Now How strong is it?

People have the tendency to overestimate what the LFD is and how strong it is, Sure it was a massive power-up for Natsu pre-timeskip, and i'll get to why.

LFD was achieved as i explained below through Laxus's LMp, and in fights, aside bad match-ups. emotional state, and will to fight, Strength usually is a major deciding factor, when i say strength i don't mean power, i mean everything, power, speed and all. Now in Fairy Tail, Magic Power is what provides all this. Now LFD was powered by Laxus's magic power. So LFD was at pre-timeskip laxus strength but here is the only difference.

example
LMp = 200
LFD = 200Mp

so the difference between laxus fighting and the LFD fighting is in the destructive power, Because the LFD used both flames and lightning, the attacks are more powerful than just flames or lighting of the same magic power. That is

LFD = 20Mp roar is greater than Fire Dragon 20Mp roar, or Lightning Dragon 20Mp roar in destructive power.
Note the LFD is not a unison raid, someone once suggested that, a unison raid is not when two magic types combine but when two different magic power combine, this means Natsu's fire and Romeo's fire could combine for a unison raid, as it happened with Juvia and Aquarius.

So the LFD is simply like laxus attacking but with higher destructive capacity, and not too high, so the LFD can be said to be a power-up from pre-timeskip Natsu to Pre-time skip Laxus, which was a massive power-up. So the power of the LFD is determined by the amount of magic power it is running on, the proof of this is when after coming back from tenryuujima, just before going to train, Natsu used the LFD, he used up all his magic power and the roar wasn't anywhere as big as the one he used while fighting hades.

So the LFD against hades was laxus with just about higher potency in attack.
Just to help you further understand think of it this way, if the same amount of magic power was used for Natsu's Dragon slayer roar and Romeo's rainbow magic fire, sure they could be the same size but the DS would be just that much stronger the same applies for LFD and Natsu's normal fire.

How strong is the LFD Now?

From above i established that the LFD is as strong as the magic power running it, so the LFD now will be as strong as Natsu. right now i think Natsu is as strong as pre-time skip laxus in terms of magic power, meaning the LFD will either be the same as it was at Tenryuujima or even slightly weaker. Why do i say weaker, i'll explain below

How does the LFD work now?

Now natsu uses the LFD and he doesn't possess LMp anymore, my theory on how it works now is, Natsu converts his NMp into lightning magic based on what his body experienced against Hades on Tenryuujima, this means this method is possible less efficient, because of the whole conversion thing and with that, possibly weaker. One thing we can use to possibly prove this lesser efficiency is, while Natsu fought hades with LMp, he didn't have much control and was using the magic anyhow, erza comments on how he burned up all the massive LMp so quickly. now when he used LFD with his own magic, he had 0 control has it consumed all his magic. That shows lesser control because natsu is normally capable of controlling his magic to give multiple roars, or it could just be that the roar from the LFD requires a high level of magic power, but this is displaced by the fact that the one against hades was bigger, and if that was the threshold then natsu won;t have been able to produce a roar against Max, so i'll settle for Natsu having less control.
This is why the LFD could possibly be weaker now, because while natsu might have the magic power to rival the one Laxus had pre-time skip, he doesn't have the conversion efficeincy.

Another thing, that in my opinion makes LFD now weaker than it was pre-timeskip is, just my personal opinion is, i doubt minerva would dare put her hand in the pretimeskip LFD's attacks, it would have been crushed to smithereens, but like i said this one is my opinion, it could simply be that the world has moved up so much that it is now possible, which i believe is a valid assumption/point.

How Suitable is the LFD for Batlles?

Natsu lacks control on it that it becomes quite unsuitable, we know that as of now, he doesn't faint again after using as shown when used against Jiemma, but it burns through his magic power so much because he can't control it, and so if there's an opponent like minerva that can just evade the attack, then he gets tired after a few attacks and gest killed for his troubles.

Now based on all this, it is my opinion that, ok before that, i just remembered something, pre-time skip laxus is about as strong as Makarov (pre-time and now.) or a little stronger or weaker, so i don't think natsu is pre-time skip laxus, but a little way off, definitely as strong as Mirajane + Erza together but not as strong as Pre-Laxus. I would have just gone to change it up there, but it might mean revising a lot of things so its better this way, so anyone reading it would adjust accordingly, so this should cement the fact that LFD now is weaker than LFD at tenryuujima.

LFD now is simply normal Natsu with higher potency. No power-up any longer because natsu has done thr power-up himself and his using his own magic

This is why i feel Erza now that IMO has surpassed makarov would defeat Natsu LFD or not, i also feel Minerva would have defeated natsu LFD or not had he continued the fight..

Now that brings me to the annoying part the new ISD, now this is even more misconcepted becauses people are just comparing it to LFD, now thats ridiculous based on the circumstances for which it was achieved.

Now we know LFD is not a fixed power but depends on the amount of magic running it, the same would be for ISD. Now we can also say ISD would have higher potency than normal Iron Dragon Magic.
I like the concept of ISD, it means Natsu isn't like some special DS and makes all the DS all the more special together which is cool.

Now ISD follows the same concept as LFD. LFD was so strong because NATSU ATE ALL OF LAXUS'S MAGIC POWER

Now Gajeel just ate a simple attack from the entity shadow, sure its enough to get him in ISD mode, as long as there are 2 magics no matter how weak, LFD or ISD can be achieved. So I only expect Gajeel to be have higher potency, because there is no way eating an attack from Shadow is as strong as the entire of laxus Magic power. So Gajeel right now should not have any out there power-up.

But the good thing about this is, after this fight, if Gajeel's body can recall the feeling like natsu and convert his own magic power into shadow, then he becomes equal to natsu again even if Natsu uses the LFD.

P.S I don't take anyone's words about who is as strong as what, like erza hyping bacchus to be her level the way she hyped Gajeel to be her and laxus level when he was in Phantom lord, if i don't believe these people, hell if i'm gonna believe shadow who for one hasn't fought natsu before but seems to think Gajeel is not as strong as Natsu. ROgue fought nastu not Shadow.

If we say this for LFD and ISD, then while using them Natsu and Gajeel are still necessarily in Gray, Frees level until proven otherwise.

comment section said it was to long, so i'm gonna use this

@wolfmaster, i fail to see your point. Zancrow's magic was still flame, he ate flame that made him stronger how is that different from him eating any other fire, sure it had a special way for him to eat but it was still flame, the flame of rebuke is the same they are all flames, the stronger the element they eat, the higher the power-up, what do you mean why didn't that stick, eating it allowed him to produce flames he had been able to produce all along, the lightning is different, i didn't sat laxus's magic power remains in him, read the post again, i said he converts his own magic into lightning, which is why LFD is not a power-up, since its just him still using his own magic power to fight, but with higher potency because he is using a combination of lightning and flames and not just flames. I never said anything was sticking. ALso show me where it was said that Gajeel nullified his magic to eat the shadow, he simply started gobbling it up, when natsu did it, makarov said his magic power dissapeared, i think it would have been mentioned had gajeel done the same thing, you can just assume thats what he did, all he said was, if Natsu can do it i can, and that is eating another element, simple. And please try to make your point clearer. LFD is on cal because he is just using a different element his body remembers which is why i said it won't be as strong as before, and the others can't be called back because they are power-ups obtained by increase in magic power, there is no way his body will suddenly recall when he was stronger and get stronger, thats madness, using a power you don't have, but recalling a preciously used element is very reasonable. The mistake i suspect you are making is you consider LFD a power, it isn't, its just a type of magic like Fire Dragon, Iron Dragon, Crash, Take over whatever, but Dragon Force is not a type of magic but a power. GET IT.

Okay again "Natsu rembers how to use lighting" , than he should be able to "rember" how to use Dragon Force & how to make Black flames if you're going by that Logic. Natsu would be like a Sponge unless Laxues lighting had a Different affect than the other two items he injested. For example Laxus gave Natsu his lighting so it went down easyier. The reason why the other two didn't stick is because he forced it down thus making reaction with his magic power. Get it ?






-Drooling rolling on floor- "Gajeel was so awesome !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!­!!!­!!!­!!!­!!!­!!!­!!' -Can't stop fapping-

Yea Gajeel was awesome~
But Frosh is so adorable <3
So who is lying Princess or Lucy?

this is pjwoww's question.Future lucy could be lying cause Jellal felt Zeref's(future Lucy's)power every year during the games right?But the princess could also be lying like she might have a connection to that power because of the eclipse...But this is just my theories.anything can happen...........

This chapter was okay imo. the fight ended on a beastly note (iron shadow dragon's roar FTMFW) As predicted Rogue was fodderised. Also the little shadow can possibly be one of two things, either: A manifestation of Zeref or the little goblin that came from Obra in RT, either way we can assume it is not a manifestation of Rogues magic because it would not have jumped off when he lost so.... yeah :/

I was confused also about the second part of the chapter. Now the princess is a suspect??? Can someone explain how if Future Lucy's dates were incorrect and what she was saying was wrong in terms of the story, how does this somehow show that the princess is lying???????? Well i dont really care about this eclipse side/main story fail plot. This section is already lolbroken and almost irrepairable so i just skim read it.

Anyways the next chapter appears to be focusing on Laxus' fight \(^o^)/!!!!!!! Looking forward to it.

P.S. Arcadios' new armor looked pretty badass but i really dont see a point to it tbh :/ And also the Genrou Knights just need to die. You were STOMPED by FT's friendship crap before and now it wont be any different.

I've had a really bad last few days, first my mifi just decided "I wanna screw with this guy, so from today onwards, i'm not gonna work" today being Wednesday 13/02/13. and then my phone that i've been using to read manga, post on here and stuff, anytime i open this forum, my browser keeps closing O.O. Its driving me nuts, then i borrowed my mom's just to post on here :(. Even that, though i wrote the above stuff, but then it closed on its own, in the end my mom needed her phone and i had to give it back. Now i'm somewhere for the weekend, where i can use a hotel's wireless, but come monday, back to the phone and i won't be posting on here, unless if course the stupid mifi, decides i've suffered enough. Now off the problem chat abd back to business. That was just to show why i haven't responded since.

@wolfmaster3000, DID YOU NOT READ MY POST, OR THE RESPONSE I PUT????. Let me break it down real well.

Fire Dragon slayer = Type of magic = Fire Magic
Fire god slayer = Type of Magic = Fire Magic
Lightning dragon slayer = Type of Magic
LFD = Type of magic

Dragon Force = Level of Dragon slayer magic

Now from above you can see that the LFD is a type of magic, it doesn't require a certain amount of magic power to be activated, it is activated so long as there is lightning DS magic and Fire DS magic in one person(natsu). now with even a little magic power, the LFD can be reached,( but you'd probably die if u tried to use a spell with that little magic.) Anyways point is even though i have just 4MP i can enter LFD provided i have lightning and fire

Now Natsu already has fire, his body naturally convert his own Magic power to fire, now his body remembers how to use lightning, so his normal Fire Magic power, is then converted into lightning (A TYPE OF MAGIC), this way he can use Fire and Lightning Dragon slaying magic, thats what gives rise to the type of magic called LFD

NOW LISTEN GOOD, natsu does not remember Laxus's magic power from the hades fight, Magic power cannot be remembered, it'll be ridiculous, its like for example(note this is not real), say you took an energy drink and are taught a really difficult move that consumes energy (we are assuming the energy drink actually gives you a lot of energy you don't normally have). So assuming you accomplish that energy consuming move thanks to the boost from the energy drink, now you know how to do the move, say in two weeks time, when u don't have that same energy and can't get an energy drink, won't you remember how to do the move, you will, but you don't have the energy to do it to the level, CAN YOU REMEMBER THE ENERGY???? i don't think so, now say you tried the move, you succeded but because you didn;t have the energy you had the first time, the move is much weaker, so meaning you can actually do the move but not to the extent you did it before. Now if u were to go for physical training in the mountains for say , 2-3 years, and your energy increased a lot, you'd still be able to perform that move but this time the move will be stronger than when you did it without the energy drink the first time.
The point i'm trying to make here, you can remember a technique but you can't remember Power.

Now you say natsu should be able to remember Dragon force, but from what i said up there, Dragon force is not a type of magic, what did zero say about it, he said it was the highest level of Dragon Slaying Magic, meaning its just a level of magic not a type

DF 1 = achieved by eating etherano, now are u suggesting he should remember magic power

DF 2 = achieved by eating all of Jellal's magic power through the flame of rebuke + his own magic power.
are u suggesting he remembers Jellal's magic power??

LFD = achieved by doing LD and FD, natsu does FD, his body remembers hoe to do LD, which is a type of magic not a magic power

Dragon Force is a state presumably achieved when a certain threshold of magic power is reached, and i suppose it varies per dragon slayer, Sting and Rogue enter DF and natsu having more magic power can't and i also suspect it adjust per improvement, what i mean by this is, while it is possible, i doubt that having the same level of Magic power he had in Tower of heaven and Oracion seis would be enough to take him to DF now. Anyways, the point is DF can only be achieved when that threshold is met, so natsu can't just remember using DF and then BAAM, he's using it, why? if u still ask after all this, because DF is governed by magic power

Now the other thing u said was why can't natsu remember how to make black flames, well black flames, for all its worth is still FLAMES. Natsu ate zancrow's flames, which while they were different from his, they were still flames, he then used the Dragon god brillant flame, true from the anime, we can see that he produces balck fire but thats only because of the magic power from zancrow he ate. Let me use what makarov said to explain, he said MAGIC IS DIFFERENT TO EVERYBODY, TO SOME ITS RED, TO SOME GREEN, OTHERS BLUE. anyways this means anyone's magic manifest in different ways

Natsu use flames
Zancrow use flames

Zancrow flames manifests as Black flames

Natsu eats zancrow's magic and while its still flames, because he has zancrows magic in him which manifest as black flames, the move he does shows his flames and black flames. Now when zancrow's magic is gone he can;t use black flame again, If u ask why can't he remember, what he remembers is the magic which is Flame magic, his body can already do that and has a manner of manifesting it, so HE CAN'T REMEMBER ZANCROW'S FLAMES BECAUSE HE ALREADY HAS FLAME MAGIC,

I tried my possible best to explain, i sincerely hope u understand.

I just thought of a very weird thing that is very important in regards to the tournament. It is a complete and utter plot hole and a fuck up (excuse my French) on Hiro Mashima's part.

Firstly, can someone explain to me how Raven tail was kicked out of the competition? They were caught cheating right? So they are icky scumbags who cheat and deserve to rot in hell (just an exaggeration). But tell me are Fairy Tail any better??? Let me explain:

1)This is the first occasion in which Fairy Tail cheated in the tournament. Jellal. I could have sworn that people who werent selected for their guilds team could not compete. Also the master could not compete. But finally the people on your team must all have the guild insignia. Jellal did not have the Fairy Tail insignia. This was a blatant breach of the rules but because he was disguised as Mystogan noone looked into it. You could explain it away by saying that Jellal did nothing for the team but lose to Jura, but then Raven Tail should not have been disqualified because even after cheating they still got decked by Laxus. So that is no excuse for this f*cking shoddy writing. Also i would understand if the member who didnt have the insignia was a mid-tier or low top-tier dude, but Jellal was one of the great Wizard Saintz. It would have been the same equivalent as disguising Makarov and putting him on your team. A clear example of where Fairy Tail CHEATED.
Reefa: But were they gonna get kicked out for it?
Hiro Mashima: No.
Reefa: Why Hiro?
Hiro Mashima: Because they're main characters, that's why :)
Reefa: (-_-) ughhhhhhh.

2) I think we all know what is coming next. Cana getting Fairy Glitter. Now obviously this was an example of cheating because it wasnt her own magic (duh). Mavis gave it to her. Because the event is meant to test YOUR strength and YOUR magical power Cana technically cheated. Sure there were no specified rules against this but that doesnt mean it is fair on other competitors. What if it was a battle situation. That is the same thing as say, Minerva giving Sting a Death Ray that one shots anyone who is battling, even Jura, then Sting goes in there and makes out like it was his own magic. CHEATING. Of course the degree of control needed to perform Fairy Glitter was needed and Cana had that control but still, putting yourself in and advantageous situation whilst others compete fairly is cheating in anyones book.
Reefa: But was she gonna get kicked out for it?
Hiro Mashima: No.
Reefa: Why Hiro?
Hiro Mashima: Because she is in Fairy Tail, that's why :)
Reefa: (-_-;) *sigh*

3) Finally, before the final day. Now i am fond of Mavis. Like SERIOUSLY fond of her. She has displayed levels of intellect that i have not seen for a long time on Shonen, maybe better than Shikamaru Nara. But this was clearly cheating. Can someone explain how the living F*CK Mavis knew about the final events settup??? She knew about it so much so that she created an ENTIRE well thought out strategy for nearly every single possible event to occur. Let me explain thoroughly. The entire tournament events are designed so that you put forward the person who is competing then the event was revealed. This way it is fair to every competitor. If you are not suited to the event, tough luck, you've screwed your chances. But through some unknown shenanigans Mavis knew before they were told! Okay i will admit that it was pretty easy to predict that an event that pertained to every person on each team would happen but how did Mavis know the location??? She was giving postitions such as 'point B-2' or 'point E-6' so this implies she had an accurate plan of the map BEFOREHAND. You could argue that she was so intelligent that she made it up on the spot but then that must mean she was telepathically sending the orders to the FT team which is still CHEATING. It is one of two things, either team Fairy Tail managed to memorise the plan from Mavis before the event and Mavis knew about the event beforehand which is CHEATING. Or, Mavis made the plan on the spot and sent the messages to team Fairy Tail telepathically which is STILL CHEATING. Take your pick please...
Reefa: But will Fairy Tail get disqualified?
Hiro Mashima: No.
Reefa: Why Hiro?
Hiro Mashima: Because only members of Fairy Tail can see Mavis so i covered it up perfectly. Im a genius dont you think :3?
Reefa: No Hiro, you are a douche and i would pay any amount of money to fly to Japan and punch the Troll off your face... >:(

There we have 3 (maybe number 2 can be written off but not 1 and 3) clear examples of Fairy Tail cheating. I have no qualms about Fairy Tail cheating in any way shape or form, they just want to win right? But what i do have a problem with is the fact that Raven Tail were disqualified on the spot for cheating and Fairy Tail never will because 1) Jellal was disguised as Mystogan. 2) There isnt a single female judge except for that bimbo Jenny and all the male judges slobber over Cana's figure. 3) Mavis can only be seen by the members of Fairy Tail so noone is catching her. 4) Hiro just loves favouring everyone in Fairy Tail. To straighten it out Hiro needs to either disqualify FT or bring back RT but we all know he wont. So yes this entire post was just to rage about Hiro favouring FT yet again. And if you plan on commenting saying something along the lines of ''OMG you made this entire post to rage go away with your opinion and shove it up your @ss'' do me a favour and dont. But what do you guys think :)?

Dude you serious about this O_O
Ok i just got a new SIM for my mifi now and its working, so i am back to give my usual novel-long response anytime, anyday, anywhere, giheehehehehe.

ANyways, back to you reefa, O.O WHAT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

IF i'm getting you right which i hope i am not, you are saying Fairy Tail is cheating by
1) Having Jellal Participate
2) Having Cana use Fairy Glitter
3) Mavis's plan


First point, Jellal being used, Its cheating, that i can agree, not because its Jellal, but only because jellal belongs to crime soceries and is a wanted criminal. Now here is the thing, the rules is people who aren't members shouldn't participate along with the masters, now Jellal could well have become a member of fairy tail the same way niichiya was unvieled as the creepy bunny mascot. We do not know that he didn't have the insignia(i doubt he does though) but its cheating no less, but you also have to consider the reason why makarov allowed him, He allowed him so he could properly investigate the dark magic, thats more like bending the rules for the right reason than cheating to me. Plus Mystogan is technically Jellal lol. My point on this is while i agree its an infrigment of the rules, i don't agree its cheating. Why?
What is cheating, Cheating is a dishonest act to gain an unfair advantage over a person or a group of persons, Fairy tail didn;t do it to gain an advantage, they had so many strong people in the reserves, admittedly not as strong as Jellal but strong enough to be stronger than most of SB so far (except minerva), they simply did it for his investigation. Its like Rukia breaking the rules to give Ichigo her powers and save his family, so did she deserve to die for that.

Second point. Lolz at this. How is this even considered cheating??. Know that mavis didn't give her the magic the instant erza defeated pandemonium, she either had it from Tenryuujima (unlikely), or was given before the tournament started, or most likely was given the day before or that day when she was to replace mystogan. Also Fairy Glitter is curious, is she given the magic power to do it, If its her magic power as it is most likely then its not cheating Its like saying lucy using urano metria is cheating because its not technically her magic. I think what she was given was the know-how, since mavis is a ghost i doubt she has actual magic power to give cana.
So this is not cheating so far as i'm concerned.

This is your funniest point to be honest, I understand why u think this is cheating, but it isn't, not in the slightest. What u are forgetting is he only part of the tournament concealed was the one named HIDDEN.
The layout of the tournament had been given since the first day. I'm too lazy at the moment to look for the scan, but i believe it was something like this

Day 1 Hidden, Battle

Day 2 Hidden Battle

Day 3 Hidden Battle

Day 4 Rest

Day 5 Hidden Battle

Day 6 ROYAL RUMBLE

Anyways even if the final day wasn't mentioned on the first day which for a reason i just remembered it might not have been. It wasn't a secret what was going to happen on the final day, remember polyruschula said it when treating lucy that on the final day there ws a battle portion in which all members participate. Meaning it was something that was known. So Mavis strategy was formed by drawing a map of crocus and using a grid system to identify points, and the patterns and how people react was as she said gotten from her analysis of the contestants' behaviour, magic power, pesonality and all else in the past days of the tournament, then she made it in percentiles meaning it wasn't a show thing that that the people would do something, and she said herself that things would get harder to predict as the fodder were eliminated, and peoeple like Kagura who showed a stoic and secretive personality went against her predictions as we saw. So, NO, this wasn't cheating by any stretch of the imagination,


The only real cheating you have hear is the Jellal thing, but i think i explained my thoughts on that and why i didn't think they should be disqualified for it, its also the reason Hiro didn't make Jellal have any impact whatsoever on fairy tail's standings except lose a match that anyone other than laxus and gildartz from fairy tail would have lost.

@T_ballack I understand were you are coming from with this but there is no way FT didnt cheat.

1) With Jellal. It doesnt matter whether or not it was to allow him to investigate the arena thoroughly it is still a breach of the rules. Jellal didnt have the insignia so he should have been barred from competing, simple as. Their intentions were good (unlike RT) but it doesnt justify their actions. If you are taking a test and you know you need to past this test to get a good grade and you want good grades because you want to become a doctor and help people. So in order to pass you use a cheat sheet. You could have had the purest of intentions but it doesnt change the fact that you went against the rules and cheated. And also it was putting them in an advantageos situation. Former Saint Wizard Jellal? Duh. Even if they hadnt intended it to be advantageous to them, even if he had no effect at all on the standings except for give them a loss, it doesnt change the fact that it was advantageous compared to the other guilds. How many other guilds had 2 (if not 4 counting Erza and Mirajane) saint wizard level mages on their team? None. And also Mystogan and Jellal are different people, one is from Edolas whilst one is from Earthland. Is Jellal a prince somewhere in Earthland? I think not.

2) Lol Mavis said she lent it to Cana "In order to win". CHEATING
link

3) Everyone speculated that it would be a royal rumble true, but for all they knew it could have been in the mountains, the arena, the outskirts of the city. Like i said there is no way in which Mavis knew the location beforehand UNLESS she cheated (via eavesdropping or telepathy). So by knowing the location before others knew the location she must have been cheating. Unless you are suggesting that EVERYONE already knew the details of the event (like the location, rules, restrictions etc.) in which case there would have been no need to explain the rules at the start of the event would there. Also when Mavis said operation Star Strike Pegasus Fairy Bomb Stategy Thingy, or whatever on Earth it is called, they all said "Roger" and began to move. Bam, right there is where Mavis communicated telepathically. We are unsure about the rest of what she was saying being heard by the team or not, but giving a command to commence a strategy is outside help, which means 6 members, which means CHEATING.

No matter how you look at it, besides number 2 which can be written off maybe, Fairy Tail were clearly cheating.

@reefa, your first point, the Jellal thing is still the only valid one, and on that i agrees that, yes they did infringe the rules, but they did not cheat. Cheating is doing something to put yourself in an advantageous position, the simple fact that fairy tail didn't do it to put themselves in a better position clears it up as not being cheating, True they infringed the rules, your example is not the same as what happened, your example, the end goal is good, but the student is still putting himself in an advantageous position and doing it intentitonally, the same cannot be said about Fairy tail. The example i gave is a much closer one, the one on Rukia and ichigo. It was against the rules to give powers to a human but rukia did it to save ichigo and his family, does that make her justified to die. Let me give a more real-life situation. It is against the law to kill, but if u were in a say plane where a gunman held everyone hostage, and through some way you managed to kill him to help the people there, I somehow doubt you'd be going to prison, you might even be considered a hero, yet its against the law. In this world we know things aren't Black and White. So i maintain that yes i agree with you, they infringed on the rules but NO they didn't cheat, thats a totally different thing and no i don't think they deserved to be disqualified

Your second point, I'm aware that mavis said i gave her in other to win, but what i said was she didn;t give her specifically for MPF, no way she could have known what the hidden event would be or that erza would cleaar it herself or that a substitute event would hold. So i said she must have given her the magic when it was decided she was going to replace mystogan(Jellal). And there is no way this one is cheating, she just gave her a type of magic, when did that become cheating, how is that different from going to train and learning a new technique just before a tournament or during the tournament. This one isn't cheating by any stretch, like i said, does that mean Lucy's Urano Metria is cheating, since by your logic it isn't her magic. She simply learned a new magic for the tournament IMO

Your third point is still strange to me, hang on let me look for the scan online. There *link. The scan below polyrishcuka says there is a battle royal on the last day, the only way she could have known this is that the event occurs on the last day of every GMG. If this is true the other guilds will know it, and it also explains why the rules where still announced, ice whether it is known or not from previous editions, the rules still have to be stated. If it occurs normally of course they'd all know. Read that chapter again, 304. When they announced that the battle field will be the whole of crocus, they said, all guilds have already spread out all around the town? so they already knew the location. When Mavis said operation star strategy activate, true they said roger, but she wasn't communicating telepathically, Notice that their eyes were closed initially, meaning she must have told them when to start, they, with all the calculations involved it is very likely they were doing a countdown and they said roger after they opened their eyes. Sure you'll ask was it part of the plan to say ROGER when they opened their eyes, the answer is no, but this kind of thing happens in animes. A plan is made, and people are at different places and the leader say MOVE OUT, even though they is no communications device or way for them to hear each other, each members says YOKAI in acknowledgement. It happens a lot. Plus Mavis doesn't have telepathy, she didn't communicate with the team at all, They already had the entire plan memorized, how do we know this, Erza said, its just as the first said, what a terrifying person meaning they already had prior instructions. Also Mavis doesn't have magic. She passed Fairy Glitter to cana doesn't mean she has magic, she used fairy sphere, but she said she used their magic and bonds to create it, not her magic. So far she hasn't shown any magic born from her magic power since she doesn't seem to have any, so how can u assume she used telepathy, and yes telepathy requires magic power, when hibiki's magic power ran out, his telepathy stopped.

Just read le new chapter... Orga got punked... o.o

yeah see I told you all Jura was a Monster no one believed than this chapter happend. I am looking forward to seeing these four wizard saints that the GM of Larmia scale mentioned

Yes like wolfmaster3000 I want to see all 4 wizard saints! OML Laxus is so cool!

I always wondered where the remaining wizard saints where, guess they've finally been mentioned. The mention of them seems to open another possible plot story, and the ishval mentioned, means there could be another country, since the 10 wizard saints are from a continent Fiore.

@wolfmaster3000, u seem to have forgotten you hyped up ogra so much, i remembered telling you, he'd be curbstomped in the clash of the 2 titans.

@reefa, i don't think the chances are like that, how do you figure?. it is not like laxus can't touch Jura, he already landed a hit, since the 2 can hit each other, we just have to see how durable they are. Know why would u come to the conclusion of 0.1%. Laxus has only started using lightning magic, he hasn't used DS magic, or his most likely now improved Dragon Force, and we are forgetting Fairy Law, which ranks with Fairy Glitter, and fairy glitter surpassed Jura's greatest magic by SOOOO much, it maxed out the MPF, meaning it is much greater than 9999, and Fairy Law rivals that, and this time i doubt that deep down in his heart laxus wouldn;t want to hurt Jura.

Laxus was so much stronger than Ogra that it was probably a troll for them to be fighting equally, listen to my reason for this, Jura used a casual yet powerful punch and he knocked out Ogra, against Laxus he concentrated and used a serious punch, it took laxus down but he shrugged it, he didn;t stagger up, he was up with a punch of his own that lifted Jura off of his feet, meaning he could tank the attack.

I don't think you should take people's words in fairy tail seriously until you see them in action, i noticed that is a mistake people make, Erza says Gajeel at Phantom lord is Her and Laxus level, turns out he is Natsu and Gray's level, things like that happen a lot, So now why would you take obaba's words seriously especially since she is supporting Jura. I agree Jura is stronger than makarov, probably jose, since we don't know how strong he is now, but THE STRONGEST HUMAN ALIVE???? PLEASE. I'm pretty sure he doesn't do too well against Bluenote stinger from pre-time skip, he might win but with difficulty. Obaba definitely doesn;t know how strong gildartz is, have we all forgotten, Jura released his aura when performing rumbling mount fuji and there is strong pressure, it wasn't even as potent as Fairy tail team that made the stadium quake, this is understandable because there are 5 ridiculously powerful wizards there, especially laxus, but my point GILDARTZ AURA RELEASE QUAKED AN ISLAND. how is jura more powerful than him or the strongest man alive, Gildartz was able to walk forward under gravity so intense it could create a black hole, over gravity so intense it could cause fairy glitter to fall (admitted it was a weaker version but still a very good feat). So i'm sorry i don't see Jura being the strongest human alive. There are people with much better feats

Gildartz breaking a black hole
Bluenote creating a black hole
Zero punking the strongest form so far, DF natsu
Natsu, in DF mode
Hades unpatched (patched form is weaker than LFD which is weaker than Jura)

So power of feelings not happening with laxus YET. not until he has exhausted all avenues.
Note Jura beats makarov but with Fairy Law, makarov wins.

My point, Jura is not the strongest human because he gets punked by Gildartz, he's magic is known for becoming hard, gildarts will simply dissassemble it, and he has no way of blocking a serious crash. Plus Gildartz basically has inhuman SUPER STRENGTH

The Gray and Juvia vs Lyon and chelia thing, its true that gray is not fresh, so it gives lyon an advantage, but i think the power gap between Juvia and Chelia is enough to balance it out. Anyways the way Gray annd Juvia could win is Unison Raid, remember Gray said they weren't working together Lyon and Chelia. There are 2 ways to go about it, Gray and Juvia could quickly combine and take out chelia, then combine and take out Lyon, meaning, its not 2 vs 2, but 2 vs 1 and then 2 vs 1. The second way is taking them both with a Full Magic unison raid, like they did in the Daphne arc.

I notice you didn't mention erza, prolly because you want her to win, but isn't her win gonna be more dubious than any others, i sense some bias lol :P. Just kidding, Erza could still win, its no different from how zoro wins even after taking so much damage, she has just as high a damage soak, from her tanking a terra clamare twice it was obvious. But i pretty much called how minerva was fighting, I knew she'd go after erza's damaged foot. To be honest i like Minerva, while her fighting still might be called dirty, she still fights smart and i like that.

I liked as they showed all fights, i'll still prefer if Laxus vs Jura was the last fight, but its still okay if they did it now

@T_ballack
Firstly, lol i was exaggerating when i said 0.1%. But his chances are still low. Jura was able to EFFORTLESSLY defeat Brain. He held his own against Jellal in a fight who imo is equal or stronger than Laxus. He has a move that has less charge time and can still score well over 8000 on the MPF (or 9000 but im pretty sure it was 8000 correct me if i am wrong) Fairy Law would probably score 9999 too but has an enormous charge time. If he attempted a Fairy Law, Jura would whip out Rumbling Mt. Fuji and come close to a one-shot. Jura's defence is solid and is one of the best we have seen, having stopped the Dark Cappricio (piercing magic from Brain). Jura in my opinion is equal to Laxus in offence and has amazing versatility with his Earth magic. And Laxus has a lot of magical power but Laxus himself said that Jura's magical energy was suffocating him, and that was just Jura leaking it a bit. So yeah Laxus' chances are low. But like i said before, skills and technique will not be an equation in this fight, the power of feelings will (as said on the last page) and so we all know Hiro will make Laxus win.

Secondly, please try not to misunderstand. I never said Jura was the strongest human alive, i said he has now been proven 'the strongest human saint wizard'. This is because the top 4 Saints are probably so strong they are not considered human, thus he is considered the strongest of the HUMAN saints. Gildarts and Bluenote are not Saint Wizards to the best of our knowledge. Ooba Babasama was hyping him up but he has well backed it up. He one-shot Orga for Gods sake. If Laxus was truly on his level why didnt he do that? He couldnt thats why. With Gajeel, do you mind telling me when Erza said Gajeel was on the same level because i dont remember her saying that at all. And generally we have to go by what people say. That is the only way we can tell what to expect, for example with Archenemy, Milliana said it would cause a cataclysm. So we all knew that when/if that sword was drawn a cataclysm is what to expect. Sadly though Archenemy didnt deliver. However you could also say that we heard that Gildarts was the strongest in the guild back when Happy said it, long before his apperance, so naturally we expected a strong dude and Hiro delivered.

Juvia and Chelia are equal in strength imo. Juvia has displayed a lot of strength and has potential to be even more beast but are you forgetting that Chelia can heal herself? Whether Hiro builds on that or not is his choice. Once again Gray should not be in a condition where he can last long in a fight. Whether he tanked a lot of Rufus' attacks or not it doesnt mean he didnt take damage. Lyon could keep pressing an attack and he may not even be able to pull a Unison Raid. But we all know Hiro will make Gray and Juvia win despite the odds so should this really be debated?

I didnt mention Erza because i WANT her to lose. Minerva is one of my fav characters at the moment and it only makes sense for Erza to lose. I have said that no matter what Hiro cannot pull anymore bullsh*t, Erza has a broken foot, lack of magic energy and fatigue so she is obviously losing.

@reefa2931, good thing that you were exaggerating about the 0.1% thing, it was ludacris. Also i don't think the chances are as low as you think. True Jura defeated Brain, but you realize there is a reason that when MASTER ZERO appeared there was a caption reading *ZERO, GUILD MASTER ORACION SEIS* and it didn't appear when Brain was shown. And that reason is that, Brain is sooo much weaker than Zero they should be considered 2 different people. The six prayer seal, Seals not just the Zero personality but most of his magic with the power of 6 powerful wizards. Brain basically has the knowledge and all nad relies on the dregs of zero's or his power. and even that minimal power gave Jura some problems. When Zero awoke, Natsu said his magic power was different from Brains and he said it was making them sick. Zero also said don't compare me to that Brain.

Brain's Dark Capriccio broke down a lot of jura's walls, and natsu was able to punch down a MUCH MUCH stronger one, albeit almost destroying his arm. Meaning natsu could punch down Jura's wall as at that oracion sies arc. Anyways Master Zero to me is still tied with GIldartz as strongest wizard shown till now, one was sooo powerful he made natsu give up with magic power release, the other punked DF natsu like a kid and that form is still the strongest till now in the whole series.

Jura got 8000+ with his move, 8245 or something, anyways, Laxus is sooo much faster than he is, he'd just use lightning body to get very far away and then use Fairy law. Fairy law takes a few seconds just so you know, probably 2 seconds(since its a 3 countdown, but tops 3 seconds), it seems slow because the characters are hypersonic in speed and are capable of moving thousands of meters in a second. Anyways, Jura isn't a speedster, laxus gets far away, cast Fairy Law fight ends, simple. and that ending you got was prolly poor translation, the one i read said something else, its said talent and skill are only part of the equation, in the heat of battle, guts, moxie and immeasurables must be factored in. Which is true, that means guts, determination are required we see people like Zoro, luffy (especially against don kreig), ichigo, Batman, show how important moxie is, i don't wanna say Natsu or anyone else from fairy tail.

You say he one-shotted ogra, and if laxus was on his level why didn't he do it, The main reason is Plot Shield, Laxus and Ogra had been sizing each other up since the beginning of the GMG, it'd be really bad if Hiro made him one-shot Ogra. Plus what is the first thing laxus did against Jura, he took of his (BOSS COAT), meaning he got serious, so he probably wanted to enjoy the fight with Ogra could be a possibilty, the same way Kenpachi didn't just stb ichigo in the throat at the beginning when he had the chance (that said, Kenpachi is a berserker so maybe thats not valid). You ask when Erza mentions Gajeel been her and laxus level lol. Thats not even all, but that was all i wanted to use before, but now you'll hear all.
She told lucy that in attack power Phantom Lord was equal to fairy tail, That both Makarov and Jose were wizard saints, understandable. Then she said they had their element 4 which are all S class and that the most worrying one was Gajeel, lolz this means she even put lolelement 4 at the same level as the fairy tail S class. Plus if i wanted to press it further, she wasn't talking about people available, but that FT and PL were equal in attack power, meaning the strongest in the guild Gajeel was lolequal to Gildartz, WAHAHAHAHAHAHA, it was sooo funny. Thats the point you realize that NAHH, not listening to anyone again. Lol totomru being Erza's level hahahahah.or Monsouir sol being Laxus......no even Fried's level, lolz.

Here is what i think you are doing,
you are comparing laxus now to the entire outcome. Its just like the Luffy vs Lucci fight.

Normal luffy gets owned by Lucci
Gear 2nd luffy keeps up with lucci
Gear 3rd luffy blows lucci away.

My point here is that, there is an increase in overall strength with increase in gears

Now Laxus now just got serious, and he isn't even getting owned by Jura, they've both landed a hit
Entering Dragon Slayer magic added to his lightining magic is Gear Second for him
Entering Dragon Force is prolly Gear third for him
Plus he still has Fairy Law which cn be his fourth gear.

SO laxus still has lot of power-ups to undergo, don't just judge by his base form which isn't even doing too badly at the moment badly

Chelia isn't equal to juvia IMO, not even close, True Chelia can heal herself, but remember she only heals physical injury, she doesn't heal fatigue and stuff, Juvia, just create a water lock on her head, stop her from breathing, lets see how thats and injury, she'd pass out. Also Gray is not in a bad enough condition that he can't use a lot of magic or last long, you make it sound like he is on his death bed, this isn't the first time that gray fights multiple difficult fights, he did so in the Phantom lord arc, against Juvia, he also took out totomru before elfman sent him skywards, he then went on to fight Jose, also in the Oracion seis arc, hefought the first round, took out an entire guild together with natsu, fought racer, had his magic power finish, fight zero, not sure he did anything to be honest, still enough mgic to destroy the lacryma. Anyways I think Juvia and gray already did a unison raid, or a combined attack, Juvia provided water and he turned it to ice, prolly by just decreasing the temperature, anyways, this kind of attack, he isn't actually creating ice with his magic power but from juvia's water. so he conserves magic.

The Erza thing, yeah she has taken a lot of damage and should lose but the same thing can be said about so many other characters in anime, Take zoro for example, against Mr 1, he had been sliced to ribbons, had buildings collapse on him, and at the point Mr 1 was prolly as strong if not stronger than he was and he won, through stubborness and the fact that there was a way. So as long as there is a way to tag minerva then she can win, we have a teleporter in Mest, and he has been tagged a lot of times, so its not impossible for her to win. We don't even know exactly what minerva's level is, so far she has only attacked strategically, when she did a seemingly strong spell of hers Erza and Kagura showed no damage, meaning that as likely as it is that she is Erza-Kgura level, she could also be below their level, so erza could whip out morning star armour, create a photon slicer, or bring out armadura fairy, she is that angry and blast Minerva back to Sabertooth guild.

And correction, she is fatigued and has an injured foot, where did you say she had low magic power, just what the hell has she done, she's only used 3-4 armours and then she's out, PUH-LEASE, at pre-time skip Edolas arc she used almost 10 different armours with sooo many attacks before running out after busting out armadura fairy, now she can only use 4?? without any major attack, she only used Pentagram sword, Sonic claw and the attack with benizansakura.

@T_ballack
Yeah i get your point about Zero and no doubt he is strong. But i see that you are comparing Zero to Brain. So obviously Brain seems weak compared to Zero. But make no mistake Brain is strong. That is like saying Natsu compared to Gildarts is almost nothing considering he can make him give up through aura alone. Does that mean Natsu is weak? Absolutely not. Brain broke a lot of walls down but it was still blocked. He just broke down a couple of the walls.imo.

Laxus is fast but Jura's reaction speed is AMAZING. He was able to keep up with Jellals Meteor despite getting hit once and could keep track of his movements. Since Jellal is calculated to be hypersonic speed+ in meteor form (which is mach 5 and above but Jellal was calced at exactly mach 7) and Jura could keep up it means that Jura can react to people moving at mach 7 speed. Laxus is calced at simply hypersonic in lightning form, not hypersonic+, which means his speed in lightning form is around mach 5- mach 6. Now we do some simple math, Jura has mach 7 or more reaction speed and Laxus has either mach 5 or mach 6 speed in lightning form. This means if Laxus tries to get away, Jura will read that and aim for his landing or his stopping point, since he does have ranged attacks. About Fairy Law, you say we shouldnt really rely on what people say right? So it is obvious that Jura now is WAY WAY STRONGER than Jose pre-timeskip and Fairy Law didnt even kill him. It could be because Makarov left him alive but they never say that. Show me where Fairy Law has killed/damaged someone stronger than Jose. In fact show me where Fairy Law has killed ANYONE at all. Going by your logic they only say it can defeat any enemy but Fairy Laws use has been attempted 3 times in the series. First time it beat, not eliminated, Jose and his shades which were not living things. 2nd time was Laxus' failed Fairy Law because of his hearts feelings and all that nonsense. 3rd time Makarov was punked by Hades. So you have no evidence proving that Fairy Law can defeat someone of higher strength than Jose. About Fairy Laws charge time. No way does it charge for 2 seconds. Considering Fairy Glitter acts like Fairy Law but on a single target it should naturally have less charge time. So you're implying that Fairy Glitter has charge time of 1 second or less? Cana would not have asked Natsu to buy her time to cast Fairy Glitter against Bluenote if it took about 0.5 to 1 second to cast it. My guess is that Fairy Glitter is about 3 or 4 seconds charge time. Since Fairy Law should be about over double that time maybe 7 or 8 seconds to charge it. This is being lenient considering in the manga and anime they make it out to be like 10-15 seconds. Fairy Law in 2 seconds? Now THAT is hilarious. Like i said if Jura has a charge time of maximum 5 seconds for the Rumbling Mt. Fuji then the second he decides to attempt Fairy Law he is getting hit by the Rumbling Mt. Fuji. But not just that Jura could use some of his other attacks to throw Laxus' of balance so he cant even gather magic energy between his hands. Im telling you Fairy Law cannot even be brought into the fight because the move only works if he can get Jura stationary through paralysis but even then, how? Juras defence could stop the 7 star chariot spell from Jellal which has the strike force of a meteor. Laxus' attcks dont measure up to a meteor.

Whether it was to help the plot or not, Jura showed he can one shot Orga and Laxus would have shown it if he could do it too. Plot armor is not appliable in debates like this because then you could say Ichiya would probably battle toe-to-toe with Erza and possibly defeat her, and we all know that ain't happening. Erza said that the element 4 were the equivalent to their S-Class mages, which means they are the S-Class mages for phantom lord. She said nothing comparable to their strength. When she said offensive power she probably didnt mean in each individual wizard. She said if both went all out both guilds will be wipped out. Understandable considering PL had AT LEAST 20 sub division guilds with probably mid to low tier fighters. Mystogan eliminated them all but in an all out war they would overwhelm in sheer numbers. Gajeel being equal to Gildarts was in no way implied. Gajeel is ruthless, cunning and destructive and he had just SINGLE HANDEDLY VANDALISED THE GUILD. Of course he is the most worriesome, or what do you think it was Monsieur Sol? No way. Also remember, certain fights dont have to go down the way they did in the actual arc. In a full on war with all members participating, we know the mid tier of Fairy Tail- Natsu/Gray and below will all be taken out by Aria. Remember that he was punking Natsu in their fight. But in an all out war Fairy Tail would win for obvious reasons. The only way you can believe that in Fairy Tail when people talk it is not viable is if you dont think Fairy Law can beat anyone who is currently above Jose's level, and that is a lot.Careful you're contradicting yourself.

With the Gear system, here is how i see it SHOULD be like:
Laxus in base form with normal lightning<Jura WITHOUT magic. Laxus was fighting on par with Orga WITH magic and Jura took out Orga WITHOUT magic
Gear Second: Laxus with Dragon Slayer Magic < Jura with Magic. Saint Wizard and could fight on part with Jellal. Also Jura has much more versatility. Laxus only has extra paralysis but Jura can block that sh*t.
Gear Third: Laxus in Dragon Force= Jura with Magic. Remember the fact that Laxus' Dragon Force has not demonstrated being anywhere near as strong as Natsu's. The strongest feat he has shown was using his roar to paralyse Natsu and Gajeel. And we know that if Jura can block something with the strength of an actual meteor he can block Laxus' roar.
Keep in mind this is how it should be to be a GOOD fight.

Now here is how Hiro will make it.
Laxus base<Jura base
Gear second: Laxus with dragon slayer magic= Jura with magic
Gear third: Laxus with the power of feelings> Jura with magic
We ALL know that Hiro will make it boil down to the power of feelings.

Now Juvia is not leagues ahead of Chelia. Im pretty sure that Chelia will be able to attack all around her to get out of a full bodied water lock. Juvia's only in a situation where she SHOULD win no matter what underwater. So that very powerful move she used in Naval Battle may not even apply here. And Chelia still has a move that could kill Wendy thus injuring Juvia a lot. If Juvia becomes water maybe she can win. Maybe. And yes Gray has shown admirable feats of endurance and stamina but that doesnt change the fact that Lyon has a full tank of magic and energy because apart from a basic freeze spell, he has done NOTHING this entire event.

With Erza the issue is not that she has low magic energy but she is physically on her last legs. Think, even if she pulls out armadura fairy right now, in her current condition, do you think she will be able to jack sh*t? Nope not a chance in hell. The armors protect her from outside attacks but if she is already damaged severly then there is no point to them. The only way she will win is if she uses an INSANE amount of rage, so much that it acts like a feelings power up and she beats the shit out of Minerva. I still wont like it but it would be understandable.

okay as for the whole speed thing Clearily that doesn't mean shit , I mean Laxus tryed & Jura Judo Chopped his sparky ass. As far his Ranking goes I'm sure Jura can out do gildarts at this point. You give FT too much credit than it's do T-Ballack in you're eyes it seems fairy tail is "God's" Guild. You don't even consider the possability of FT loosing. why ? because Hiro has had FT win so much We expect it to happen. Than when a character like Jura comes up everyone get's all defensive oh Laxus can do this. or Natsu can do that. we also saw Jura charge Ogra before he was able to launch his attack (well i'm asuming before he was able , or he dodged at the last second ) witch ethier way is still pretty quick. if you ask me Jura really does have the Advantage in this fight. BUT we all Know what's going to happen "NO I can't loose i'm part of fairy tail instert bullshit phrases of family & friends."

@reefa, i only mentioned zero because u said Jura beat Brain effortlessly in response to my saying zero was above him. True Brain was strong, i never said he wasn't he was the strongest of the 6, but he is leagues weaker than zero, i said that to show that He is leagues above Jura. When i said he gave jura trouble i meant speed wise, he is very fast but didn't show anywhere near zero's speed that was able to overwhelm DF natsu that was wayy faster than meteor. But even Brian's speed could get in the blindside of Jura in an instant, admittedly he was able to react, but had brain continued that method, it'd have been like the Lee vs Gaara fight, he wouldn't have been able to keep p for long, anyways thats not my point.

What are you on about Jellal is hypersonic+ true, but travel speed using lightning body (not the one he used against jura, thats just him coating himself with lightning), anyways, the one he used against hades, he has lightning timing, and he was able to use it in a fight against hades, and i think lightning timing is around Mach 450 or something, anyways, laxus isn't this speed normally, just in that lightning form. Laxus is faster than Jellal. Jura might have good rections, but they are nowhere near amazing, he wasn't able to react to metoer, make no mistake, but the speed of his magic can keep up with meteor, thats what is amazing. Jura doesn't have any long range attack, Jellal wasn't trying to get away from the stadium, if he was, i'm pretty sure he would have, Laxus can get as far away as possible no problem.

You talk about Fairy Law, and saying we don't know becaause we only have what poeple say, True. But as for not killing Jose, i doubt the magic kills, since its Fairy Tail's philosophy not to kill. It just utterly defeats. Now we know that Fairy Law was strong enough that Hades had to whip out grimoire law to stop makarov, we saaw that Hades thanks to the limitless durability from his heart pretty much Tnked everything thrown his way, but Fairy Law made him whip out grimoire law. Now that might not be much but it is possible to infer that Fairy Law would have defeated a wizard of Hades caliber. but here is my main proof. Jura's strongest magic the rumbling mount Fuji grossed 8245 or something in strenght, but Fairy Glitter that rivals Fairy Law is much greater than 9999, you might say that wasn't Jura's strongest magic but his reaction to the power of Fairy Glitter is enough to tell you it was too strong for him, so that is proof that Fairy Law would still defeat Jura. Laxus's Fairy Law had a range of the entire country of Magnolia, nothing stops him from running to the mountains and casting it with the sole purpose of defeating Jura. The way makarov casted his to only affect Jose but leave out the others like Aria and Gajeel.

About the charge time, remember once they start it, they count to three, and the countdown isn't slower than the seconds hand in a clock, so tops 3 seconds, you might think it longer because laxus stopped when doing his, anyways and remember while Fairy Law is being casted, any magic sent its way gets eaten, so rumbling mount Fuji would be vapourized, thats how destructive the light is, especially since we have proof that it is >>>>>greater than rumbling mount Fuji.

Lolz at your argument on Jellal's grand chariot, true it had the power of a metoer, but remember natsu was hit by the 7 and still stood up, and he was hit by laxus and couldn't move, even the raging bolt might have vapourized him, the halbred rendered Gajeel with soo much damage he needed so many bandages, and before the halbred he had only taking one serious hit and that was the roar and GAjeel has higher durability than natsu. So laxus's attack clearly hit stronger than metoers, as it would seem.

Erza said they were equal in attack power, and that their S class were as strong as their S class, and Gajeel. She totally inferred Gajeel being Her and Laxus level. You say in an all out battle. Have you forgotten that Natsu and gray took out an entire guild with an attack each in the manga, Evergree, but bixlow mainly took out an entire guild, In an all out battle, mystogan will still have taken out all the fodder sub-division he took out, his sleep mantra simply gets everyone to sleep, lets not forget Gildartz aura release wold bring everyone down from phantom Lord, and he can punk Jose with a few hits. Phantom Lord was in no way close, and that thing by erza was clearly showing that in terms of people's power don't take what anyone says.
Oh and what do you mean they'll all be taken out by Aria, remember Gajeel was stronger than Aria, Natsu wasn't properly motivated against aria and mainly he had used up magic and needed to eat, as shown against Gajeel. And in a full all out fight, Laxus would have taken out all of the element 4 the same way he did raven tail, one-shotting them all, mystogan dices Gajeel, and the rest become Fair Game.

How could you say he is stronger without magic. Laxus didn't even take off his coat against Ogr which i call not getting serious tbh. And from what we have seen from their fight, They have both landed one punch, how the hell can you say one is stronger in that form, laxus has so mny things he hasn't used as does Jura, but he has more power-ups than Jura at the moment. His Dragon Slayer magic, his Dragon Force which would have gotten stronger by now. Plus he hasn't used lightning body like he used against hades. So my point is, ITS TOO EARLY TO SAY JURA IS STRONGER, so far they have been shown equal, and i think laxus has a chance at victory because he can still get much stronger than he is fighting now and has an attack that we ARE SURE IS FAR GREATER THAN JURA.

as of right now until proven otherwise
Base Laxus = Base Jura.
Laxus hasn't really started using magic too, true he has coated himself, but thats something that seems to happen normally with him, like he discharges lightning. until we see his magic attacks like the Lightning bullets, raging bolt, lightning eruption and so on, he hasn;t started fighting with mgic, the same way Jura hasn't started, we haven't seen his rockiron wall and all other attacks.

But i accept that, you have your own guess on what the power increase should look like, but i have mine too, i'm not saying mine is right, all i'm saying is that the only thing we know that is true so far is what i put up there, Base Laxus = Base Jura, here is how i think it stands

Base Laxus = Base Jura (from next episode they'll start using magic so we will be left with this)
Laxus with Lightning Magic < or = Jura with magic
Laxus with DS Mgic = or > Jura with magic. (I say it this way because laxus is likely going to mix Dragon Slayer Magic and lightning magic not long into the fight)
Laxus with DF >>>> Jura. It curbstomps Jura
Fairy Law ROFLCOPTERLOLCURBFREAKINGSTOMPS JURA

Juvia is much stronger than chelia, i agree that chelia can break water lock, but what i said was she takes a water lock to the head, and as wolfmaster3000 told me, Juvia can;t be hit by normal attacks, i thought in fairy tail people with elemental body could still be hit but @wolfmaster3000 said she's only been hit by special attacks, this means Chelia can't hit Juvia, Juvia can continously hit her until she tires out an there was a river around, she'd just use a water nebula to get chelia into the water and use her water magic to keep her underwater, even Chelia admitted herself to being weaker in water, with this Juvia defeats Chelia. I agree its gonna be pretty damn difficult for Gray to defeat Lyon as he is, which is why, he and Juvia will double team him. MY POINT, I'M NOT SAYING FAIRY TAIL IS GOING TO WIN THIS FIGHT OR HAS TO WIN THIS FIGHT BUT THAT THEY CAN WIN THIS FIGHT, and i'm saying it because you and wolfmaster clearly think Fairy Tail cant win and that if they won, its because they are fairy tail and i'm just trying to tell you legit ways in which they can win. I'd like to see a good fight who ever wins.

The Erza issue, true that she is physically damaged but she does have an armour that grants her flight doesn't she, i'm not sure, maybe the black wing armour, anyways all she has to do it ex-quip the armour, stand still and shoot a photon slicer, she can still fight normally to be honest, she just might find it difficult to run around, what i think decides this battle is if she is able to figure out minerva's power on time, The injured foot i'm not concerned about, I know you might say this is bias or something but i have a perfectly reasonable reason for saying this, Against Hades they took worse, hades's bullet magic where such that they were capable of shattering walls and pure stone, she took multiple to her limbs and didn't even have this much magic power, literally, and she still continued moving, she tanked TERRA CLAMARE TWICE for christs sake, so i don't think an injured foot is a problem, you say FATIGUE and i'm like YEAH, thats a real problem, but you say an injured foot, SERIOUSLY??? In a manga you say an injured foot, we aren;t even sure the bone is broken, she was still able to stand without wincing. So i think erza's problem now is Fatigue and Figuring out Minerva's magic. I'm being objective here

@wolfmaster3000. Really, you are sure he can out do gildartz at this point?? My problem with you u just say stuff you have no evidence on, if u wanna say that kind of thing say IMO, so we know its what u think, when i make assumptions like that, i indicate. Now you say you are SURE he can out do gildartz, howw?? because Makarov said so?? because obabasama who hasn't even seen Laxus fight much less Gildartz said so?. When all evidence points to Gildartz being stronger, GILDARTZ CRASHED AN ENTIRE VILLAGE/SMALL TOWN AND THE CRACKS STILL EXTENDED OUT OF THE SCANS, this indicates it was probably much farther than that, wanna know the worst part, HE WASN'T EVEN TRYING. He quaked an entire island with his aura, remember that even lucy wasn't knocked out when Jura realeased his aura, Gildartz at the moment is in a league of his own, don't bring him up yet, so far unless people show by feats they aren't near as strong as gildartz, its why i only consider DF natsu, obviously and Zero that punked DF natsu easily as his level at the moment.

I don't always expect Fairy Tail to win, its quite the opposite, you want Fairy Tail to lose soo much that you don't care if its Frosch that beats Laxus. I have no problem with Jura beating laxus but to do it, he has to show feats that he can is all i'm saying, I GO BY FEATS, NOT I WANT THIS GUY TO WIN OR I WANT THIS GUY TO LOSE LIKE YOU DO. If Erza went up against Jura she'd lose, feats, powerscaling and level shows this, If Natsu went up against Makarov he;d lose. If Freed Went up against Hades he'd lose, If Mirjane went up against Jellal, she;d lose. I decided winners of fights by feats, what they've done. level they are, not just on bias like you seem to do. If u want me to say Jura beats Laxus let him do something that shows that, until then i'm afraid i'll go with logic , which is at the moment in this fight they seem on par. It is my opinion though that laxus is the stronger, he is the type that like luffy has levels that go higher and higher and isn;t fixed like people like Jura, Makarov, Natsu(now that he has LFD i suppose he doesn't belong here). I don't say Fairy Tail has to win because they are fairy tail, thats what u believe, if i did, i wouldn't give reasons for my opinion, if think otherwise, state why, don't just say, NO, THIS IS WHAT I THINK, BELIEVE IT YOU HAVE NO CHOICE AND I'M NOT GONNA GIVE ANY REASONS WHY.

Again what you're not realsing is it's been seven years since FT has fought or done ANYTHING. EVERYONE ELSE has gotten stronger in those seven years 3 months of training doesn't compare to 7 YEARS of Combat everyone else has done. Gildarts 7 YEARS AGO might of been in a league of his own. Now he's proabily not so much, He's like Erza & Laxus most people are proabily equal to or greater than him. The only reason why Erza & laxus & Gildarts didn't need to train is because of there second orgin as stated in the first bit of the time skip. & yes I am going to take Makarov's word on Jura being stronger than everyone in this tournement right now BECAUSE IT'S TRUE. It's the same beef I have with saber tooth you don't get the title of "wizard saint" much less the title of "Strongest HUMAN Wizard saint" by sitting around with you're thumb up you're ass. 1. Jura was able to out do Brain, 2. he did put up a fight against Zero for a bit. Than you don't see him until now the proof you want No one can give to why > because Hiro is too concenered about Fair ytail you can only give all of these assumptions about FT members because there the main focus. & you're doing exactly what Isaid you feel threatend at fact that you're precouis FT members have a chance to loose. it's the same with all of the other guilds espcailly the new ones that came up we have no idea what they can do because we haven't seen character Devolpment or the stages of there strength like we have for Fairy tail. Do you want to keep going with this ? ,

@T_ballack
Okay i understand now why you mentioned Zero. Sorry i thought he was a bit irrelevant but i get it now.

Lol, when it comes to speed let me put it into simpler terms. Jellal using Meteor has a speed of mach 7. Jura was keeping up with him. Did Jura get hit by Jellal? Yes. But was he forcing Jellal to dodge his attacks? Yes. So he was keepig up with him. If he wasnt Jellal would have blitzed him so many times it is not even funny. Back on topic. Thus Jura has a reaction speed of AT LEAST mach 7. Now Laxus does not move at the speed of lightning. The only instance is where he travels through lightning channels in the sky, so unless it is a stormy day he aint moving at lightning speed. When he goes into his lightning form he converts his magic into a form of lightning and coats himself with it, boosting speed and offence but not at the speed of lightning. He has a confirmed speed of approx. mach 6 in his lightning form. If Jura has mach 7 reaction speed whilst Laxus has mach 6 movement speed in lightning form. So obviously Jura can keep up with him. With Laxus' attacks there is no way they are like Jellals. You seem to think that because Laxus downed Natsu and Gajeel then his attack is as strong as Jellals but that is not the case. For example, if you somehow threw a plane at a normal person it would obviously crush them right? Now there are two people, and you throw a truck. It will still flatten them both, doesnt mean it has the same force as when you threw the plane. Jellals attacks are the plane. In comparison, Laxus' attacks are the truck. Jura has shown defence capable of blocking an attack with the strength of a meteor. So obviously Laxus attack isnt going to touch him. That's how it should be LOGICALLY.

And lol, i dont think running into mountains is allowed in this tournament but even if Laxus did, he still wouldnt hit Jura with Fairy Law. You oversestimate the range. We can tell that Fairy Law has a range of approx. the size of Magnolia. So Laxus going into mountains would just waste his and Jura's time. Heck even if he went to the edge of the city it probably wouldnt hit because Crocus is bigger than Magnolia. So he has to stay within range. And you still havent shown that Fairy Law can take out someone stronger than Jose pre-timeskip. Sure Hades whipped out Grimoire Law but that still doesnt prove anything. Also what if Jura just shields himself from the light. There has been no evidence to suggest that Fairy Law levels out buildings or structures. It is essentially just a light :/ So if Jura did the same move he did to Natsu and co to protect them from the bomb then he wouldnt be wiped out and Laxus has lost a lot of energy. You see you are using what we call a no limit falacy. Because someone said that Fairy Law repels all the caster deems an enemy, you know think that it can eliminate ANYONE with no evidence to back it up. Can it eliminate Zeref, Acnologia, the other Dragons, The Wizard Saints? You just dont know that yet, but you assume it can because it said that it repels all the caster deems an enemy. That is a NO LIMIT FALACY.

Im gonna stop the conversation about Phantom Lord because it probably will not go anywhere and i already said Fairy Tail will probably win. Now back on topic...

I will repeat what i said: Laxus in base form with normal lightning magic > Jura without magic.
THIS IS FACT. It was just proven. Laxus was fighting Orga with magic and they were on par. It means nothing if taking off his coat makes him serious, he was using magic and they were on par. Then Jura strolls in and one-shots Orga WITHOUT magic. Show me where laxus has one shot ANYONE without magic, then we will talk further about this.

The whole gear system, there really isnt much i can do about that as it is your own opinion and i have stated mine too. Agree to disagree i guess.

About Erza. I struggle to find why you have soooo much belief that Erza can overcome anything. It doesnt matter who you are, an injured foot whether it be broken or not will impede her movement even slightly. Erza has overcome injuries far beyond this but you forget that Minerva has a massive advantage her and Erza's chances of victory are, LOGICALLY, about 1-99 in Minerva's favor. Now that '1' is assuming that Hiro decides to push the emotion rage as much as he does nakama power and hey presto! Erza has a new power up! Ughhhhh, but it is the only way she can LOGICALLY take this.

You seem to have it the other way around, logic dictates that Jura should win. That is why Hiro puts his characters against people of a higher level then them. So that he can defy logic. There is only a slight chance that Laxus could take this and that is if it is stormy and Laxus merges with real lightning, then he can just blitz Jura. But Laxus doesnt even go lightning speed normally. If so he would be the fastest character in the series and he would just blitz everyone to death and wouldnt lose once. LOGICALLY, Jura has this in the bag.

Also Anyone else find Laxuses facail expression funny. I did & i'll tell you why it's not because he looked scared or unsure if he could win he looked annoyed his facail expression to me when he started fighting Jura is "why , why me WHY OF ALL PEOPLE am I stuck fighting Jura." Like he really doesn't look like he wants to fight Jura XD it just cracked me up .

Not really feeling up to it, but i'll have to respond anyways, i'm sick tbh, feeling very tired. Tonikakun

@wolfmaster3000, It won't be prudent to revist a past argument on training time, while i also feel those with 7 years time had the advantage but what i wanted reefa to consider at the time was, before the time-skip, was a typical day in fairy tail Training at all? No much less intense training, so the seven years would have simply been going on different jobs, true there will be serious progress in their powers, but 3 months of intense almost 24 hours training would definitely go a long way to filling up that seven year gap, its like saying A student who reads 30 minutes almost everyday for 7 years and a student who intensely studies almost 22 hours everyday for 3 months. True that when fairy tail came they were behind the times, but i blieve it was said that Laxus and Gildartz were so strong that the still held their own in current times, but surely they would have moved down in rank, but after the intense training from Fairy Tail, we know they went really up, its like in One Piece, Pre Time-Skip, Luffy was no where near vice admiral level, then he went 2 years training, didn't the vice-admirals have 2 years too of fighting pirates and all, they had 2 years plus the previous superiority they had over him, stemming from years of experience and all, but luffy caught up and prolly surpassed them, how is that different from this. You seem to be forgetting that laxus went through intense training without second origin. And what makarov said was Jura would be a match for Gildartz which is pretty funny, you realize that we only know that Jura is stronger than makarov and that isn't even official. Before you bite my throat off lemme explain.

Pre-Skip. With Jose, Jellal, Makarov and Jura. We knew Jura was the weakest.
Now Obabasama says its definite he has become the 5th stongest saint, know that this is with the fact Jellal is no longer a wizard saint, so we don;t still know who is stronger. Jose is no longer a wizard saint, considering he escaped, we don't know if he has gotten stronger, so we don;t know if Jura is stronger, all this i mean officially. Finally it was decided Jura was the 5th strongest while Fairy Tail was absent meaning makarov's strength wouldn't have been considered, so its not official he is even stronger than makarov, but we can infer that he is, since makarov didn't improve in seven years and his health is on the decline. True that you have to be strong to be wizard saint, but LOLZ YOU ONLY HAVE TO BE AS STRONG AS TOWER OF HEAVEN ERZA TO BE WIZARD SAINT LEVEL, that was why jellal was going to use erza for his R-system. Now Strongest Human wizard saint you are gonna have to agree wiith me is only as impressive as the other human. I mean i can be the strongest person here and not be too strong, anyways seeing makarov is one of the saints, i admit its impressive. But there are so many people stronger than the so called wizard saints level or around the level.
Umm.....you aren't calling the defeating Brain thing a feat likened to Jura right??. Brain was powerful, very powerful and Jura did well to beat him, but Jura never fought Zero, make no mistake, had he done so, he would have been stomped so bad it would not have been funny, Zero punched DF natsu down, and remember DF natsu scattered Jellal with a punch and Jellal as Jura admitted was stronger than him. Meaning Zero would have one-shotted Jura in the Oracion seis arc, you might be right that Mashima doesn't concentrate too much on others as he does with fairy tail, but isn't that how it is in mangas, how many times did we see the admirals fight before marinefold, how many times did u see ace fight, whitebeard pirates, hell shanks hasn't still been shown, so don't say it like its just Fairy Tail, moreover. Laxus feats comes from one fight, Jura had one fight too, as did Gildartz but they have more impressive feats than Jura. Anyways i don't feel threatened by anything, whether they lost or not the manga would go on.

Anyways Gildartz has a kind of similar personality and drive like natsu, the same way natsu was annoyed he got stomped by erza and wasn't allowed to face laxus that he went training and on an S-Class mission, I think Gildartz would have realized that times had moved on and i don;t see him just going round and round womanizing, he'll prolly be training since he tols natsu he also won't lose and would fight him anytime, but who except mashima knows, i'm just saying based on his profile.

@reefa2931, you say Jellal is Mach 7?? and Laxus is tops Mach 6. what feats where they calced off of, and also give me a link to the calc, cos i have a calc here putting Laxus's feat against mystogan at Mach 11, and thats still way back pre-timeskip and its not his fastest speed. Let me tell you, in the fight, typical mashima, for the fight to be interesting, he wouldn;t make speed count, if not Laxus would LOLBLITZ Jura, laxus blitzed hades who had more impressive speed feat by dodging laxus's roar, he was able to leave the front of hades where he cast the amaterasu spell, which was a good distance, and then go all the way round before hitting him in the back of the head, and all this hades was still looking at the same spot, meaning it was prolly in less than a second. probably less given hades's reaction time and speed.

You missed my point, Natsu took Jellal's 7 metoers and stood up, and this was after he had taken a lot of serious hits from Jellal, but a fresh Natsu that had only taken a few punches and kick, took a hit from laxus and couldn't stand, and the same for gajeel. Weak Natsu Tanks Grabd chariot and stands, Fresh Natsu takes Laxus attack and can't stand along with Gajeel. doesn't that mean by ur representation, Jellal's magic is a bicycle thrown at a persom that injures the person but the person still stands and Laxus attack is a plane thrown at 2 people, that crushes them??.

Plus Pre-time skip Laxus had better Durability feats than Jura. Jura got outdone by bomb. that had what range, seriously??. LAXUS TANKED AN ATTACK THAT TOOK OUT MAKAROV, he tanked it then attacked hades after, though admitedly he felt some effects as he dropped to a knee not long after, but he could have kept on fighting, and immediately after that, he tanked Hades attack prolly as strong if not stronger than the bomb jura took, he took the attack, and without magic no less, and was able to remain conscious, considering that this was magic meant to kill him. Not long after without recieving any magic like those with the insignia did, he was able to sneak up on Hades with his speed and deliver a hit, and all this without magic. Much better than fainting from a bomb don't you think.

I understand what you mean by no limits fallacy, and i didn;t want to fall into that, which is why i gave evidence, the MPF showed that Fairy Law's strength far surpasses Jura's strongest magic, meaning he'd be wiped out by Fairy Law. Fairy Law convered the whole of magnolia because that was what laxus wanted, so it could have a larger range, but we don't know. But you are really funny you know, you say Fairy Law doesn't level buildings. and i'm like O_O SERIOUSLY??. Fairy Law is a magic that calls forth a light so destructive that it wipes out all the caster considers in his heart to be enemies?? O_O WHEN'D LAXUS START HAVING ENEMITY WITH BUILLDINGSSS, so you see why it doesn't level buildings?? But what Fairy law does is, while it is being casted, it consumes every magic used against it, remember against Jose while makarov was in his countdown, Jose used his strongest magic, saying he wouldn't hold back, but Fairy Law consumed it, meaning, while it is being casted unless u use magic to punch, if u shoot is as a projectile as jura does it will simply eat up your magic, If jura protected himself, Very law would destroy and eat up whatever move he does. So Fairy Is definitely going to beat him, unless Mashima makes laxus cast it and Jura survive.

Personally i don;t see any reason laxus didn;t just cast it at the beginning of the Battle royal, Fairy Tail would have won from the off, not because it would take out everyone, which it might well do, but because they'd have amassed so much point, they couldn't lose again, lolz just kidding, that would have ruined the story and a lot of feats would have never been made, like OGRA'S FACE GETTIN SMASHED HIM..

Yeah its best to stop the Phantom Lord thing, i was planning to, i didn;t think it was gonn lead anywhere

Lolz, Jura one-shotting OGRA was very impressive but how the hell does that prove he is stronger than laxus with lightning, Laxus got hit with a punch more powerful than the one that took out ogra, since he did that meditating thing he does when he gets serious and laxus got up fine, he didn;t stagger up or nything, he got up and delivered his own punch. Its like saying because ERZA knocked out Natsu without magic in the manga and laxus didn;t then ERZA IS STRONGER. LOLZ at that logic (I'm talking of the time when natsu came at erza with magic, the one in the train i don't remember if it happened in the manga). So i believe that disproves your logic.

The Erza thing, its not me having believe in erza to be honest,i was just telling you things that are fact and cannon to show that an injured foot won't impede her too much. But i think for this issue, i should ask question. HOW STRONG IS MINERVA, i want officially, don't tell me what u think its ur opinion but what has been official so far. I have my reasons for asking that question, and i look forward to hearing your answer.

There is no logical reason for Jura to absolutely take this so far, if there is list the feats here, no words or hype just feats, Taking out Ogra with a punch?? Laxus already tanked a stronger one from him no problem, so that's not a feat showing he can win, look for another one. Rumbling Mount Fuji?? Laxus already has a stronger move, in Fairy Law, Hall of thunder and likely DF attacks. Do you see my point? whether Jura can win or not is not the issue, but he hasn't shown any feat to prove it yet, while Laxus has shown more. If there are any feats apart from the ones i called feel free to tell me.
I agree that Laxus doesn't have lightning speed as his combat speed, but he does have it as travel speed and has used it, unlike enel. A mistake you make is, THERE WASN'T A STORMY DAY ON TENRYUUJIMA. remember the test?? there was no stormy day, if anything, it was sweltering hot. It initially started to rain because Juvia got seriously mad and psychotic, which was awesome by the way. The lightning in th sky was caused by Laxus's power and had nothing to do with the weather. He travels through cloudy channels not lightning channels and there are always clouds in the sky.

How dare you compare One piece to this Garbage & yes in the two years Luffy trained he did become strong but he's still no match for the admiarls he struggled really hard against both Hoodie & Ceasar Clown. One Piece is completely Diffrent than this in so many diffrent levels. The two years that Luffy & his crew spent training didn't get him up to par with the admiarls AT ALL as Kizaru , Akainu & Kuzan (at the time) didn't even use there full power against Luffy when they fought they were merely playing around. Any Anime being compared to One piece is stupid. One piece has a way diffrent Story arc & a much better plot & more detailed Weaknesses as that sense of Luffy just barely wins against His vallains. as to Fairy tail completely Blow's there Vallains out of the park with no effort or precaution or any sigin of struggling really.

@wolfmaster3000, i don't think this is the right place to mention one piece, i never said admirals read the post, i said vice admirals. The point i was trying to make was, if u go by ur logic that in three months people can't become so strong, then there isn't any use for time;skips, Luffy did not struggle against hordy, he completely overwhelmed him on land, and when underwater, he did have some trouble but in the end it was mid difficulty at best, the only one on one fight that luffy has barely won, was against Lucci, the fight was epic, and in fairy tail u have Gajeel vs Natsu fight like that, Erza scarlet vs Erza knightwalker. You mention don't compare Fairy Tail to One Piece, one piece is good in its own right, and its totally anyone;s opinion to decide which is better in anime sites, the ranking usually goes, Naruto - First, Fairy Tail - Second , One Piece - Third, Bleach - Fourth, it usually flunctuates with Fairy Tail and one piece interchanging but in most sites Fairy Tail is mostly second, so maybe its ur own opinion that its garbage but its clearly worth more to other people. You are one of those guys that worship the HST.

No one piece has a much better story & characters & over all devolpment compared to fairy tail, It's taken Luffy so much Longer to get to where he is. really only Lucci ? , because Crocdile gave him two near death exprinces, Moria gave him TONS of trouble , Kuma also was able to single handly defeat the straw hats, of course the epicness that is CP9 my favourite post time skip arc. Arlong & even don kreig gave Luffy trouble Luffy has struggled time & time again. Oh in the Marine ford arc Luffy kept getting himself kicked to the cirb only to have everything fall apart. You have that ranking backwards One piece is number one every where dude it's the most popular ^_^ it really is. Yes Hordy gave Trouble in water , even on the Noah (witch would count as dry land). As to wear Fairy tails Victories (after Zero ) all became almost instant Hades & Zero were the last true Vallains that FT has struggled against. & so far yeah there hasn't been a need for a time skip in FT. Ever since elfman Won his match Fairy tail hasn't stopped winning as to wear before they were struggling a bit witch I enjoyed it was good character devolpment it was alot of us going "wow can fairy tail pull this off ? these mages are kinda tuff." , now it's "oh yeah I know Fairy tail's going to win" & it's all because Hiro can't stand his precouis members of fairy tail having the snot kicked out of them. As to wear Oda goes Luffy's going to hell & back to reach his goal he's going to lose ALOT of things along his way & he won't always come out with a "new alley" or the "hero". Naruto too has lost it's edge of "oh Naruto might loose" Same with Bleach. Naruto , Bleach & Fairy tail have lost track of what they want to come out of there story I'll argue that till i'm blue in the face & than some. One piece hasn't lost it's edge why ? because it comes up with new ways to capture us new ways for us t osee yeah the characters are Uber powerful but in the long run there really fucking weak compared to sum even after there two year training. Like Rember when you first Saw Luffy get beaten by Crocdile IDK about you but I was like well fuck , But you still of that sense come on he's the main character he won't Die kinda thing. Fairy tail, Bleach & Naruto are trying to that but are going about it the wrong ways

@wolfmaster, true one piece had a better storyline and for that i praise Oda. He made the story line such that it has no set time, and so a place can be medevial, another can be modern, one an use technology, another might use crude methods, and also the notion that the grand line is crazy especially the new word allows him to throw pretty much anything radical and explain it off with an aberration of Magnetic fields, lol, anyways he ould pretty much put and it rained Babies and we'd say YEAH, DUH, ITS THE NEW WORLD, so my point is, his storyline and setting is so good, that it allows for diversity and flexibility, so on that i agre with you, the main storyline is much better than Fairy Tail. But you say character development, I'm sorry but i beg to differ, First one piece has been going on since 1998 i think and fairy tail started maybe 2006 or something, aside the advantage One Piece has, it still doesn;t have character development, How many characters have we seen their development aside the Strawhats, Ace, Jimbei (to some extent), Wiper. The main people with the character development are the main characters, have we seen anything on Whitebeard (him drinking with roger can hardlly be called development), or even from any of his commanders, or the yonkou, or shanks or the shichibukai, barring hancock, and that was just touched, so u say, and in Fairy Tail, we have good character development, for Lucy, mainly, Erza, Gray, Laxus, Mirajane a little, Juvia, Gajeel, these are people in the guild, so who outside do we have for, We have for Mystogan, Pantherlily(before he joined Fairy Tail), Lyon, Milliana and her lot, Jellal, Wendy. Anyways, the same laws apply in all manga, only main character's development are shown, and the only time others are shown is during arcs involving them.

If u look at it in the general sense of things Crocodile might have been a tough opponent, but what i meant was, The first time they fought, Luffy was unable to touch his logia body so he was impaled, but he gripped crocodile so had that crocodile flinched, he realized how to touch him, the second time they fought, he figures he could use water, and with that he actually beat crocodile but crocodile could absorb water so even that wasn;t effective, now the third fight, is what i considered the fight. Why? because luffy found a way to touch him, and they could finally hit each other fair and square, and during this fight although luffy was exhausted, He WRECKED CROCODILE'S SHIT no problem, thats what i mean, Against arlong he didn't nearly almost lose, the fight was going in the balance and he won in the end. Against don kreig, While being at a disadvantage in that he could really use his mobility because of the sea he was still able to win without being in too much danger aside the falling into the sea thing. Against Lucci is when he could truly have said he won with max difficuty. and you talk as if One-piece doesn't have its problems we just ignore them, Luffy suddenly whips out the gear system, REALLY and no one taught it strange, its like Natsu for no reason suddenly start using maybe DRAGON POINT ROAR and its 4 times as strong, you'd be the first to point out its nakama power or a fake power-up but yet the gears re just accepted, because of the physiology thing, yeah, right. Red HAwk?? How the hell does he produce fire, we accept that his body is on overdrive in gear second he hits up, but now his blood can produce fire??? REALLY. Just before luffy whipped out gear 2nd, against Blueno. Blueno had previously blitzed him to death at Water 7, then few hours later they get to enies lobby, and suddenly luffy equals him in speed, how did he become faster in a few hours?? anyone question this, NO?? We accept it because its the GREAT ONE PIECE, there are many more, but i'll stop here. But i want you to consider this, If the word nakama was never mentioned, how do you honestly think you'd react if, Erza got hit by terra clamare and she stood up, then she got hit again and stood up, we'd say erza is able to tank that, but because they always mention that protecting their friends is what gives them drive, we say they only stand up due to nakama power.

The Problem I honestly think Hiro Makes is this, charaters that are weaker than Fairy Tail, he lets them win in the first encounter, and when Fairy Tail wins, people believe they have used nakama power-up

@wolfmaster i wanna know something, could you list all fights in fairy tail you think has been won by nakama power.

Also the GMG, true Fairy Tail were struggling at the beginning but was there a drastic change?? IMO, NO.

Let me tel you why? In a competition, the strongest person doesn't necessarily win, what i mean by competition is not a fight but events, take the Devy Back Fight for example, if it was decided by strength then The strawhats would have CURBSTOMPED but why were the Foxy's winning. Its the same as the GMG

First event, do you believe if someone like hibiki participated in the event he would have won, rufus won because his magic allows for a map with radar system, same as hibiki. Not because anyone was stronger or weake, Next event Fight, Lucy vs Flare IMO they were equal with lucy stronger by virtue of Urano metria (come to think of it, had lucy just summoned Loki, she'd have won), anyways, outside interference they lost, Jura vs Jellal, outside interference, they lost. next event chariot, well natsu and transportation. so do you see that if they started winning it wasn't sudden, conditions had simply been causing them to lose. In hidden section was the only unpredictable won, and how did fairy tail perform

1st Hidden - 7th and 8th
2nd Hidden - 6th and 7th
3rd Hidden - 1st and 2nd (you could hardly argue with this)
Final Hidden - 2nd and 3rd (with Lucy getting demolished)
so way i see it, the problem they had was hidden since that was the competition aspect, the fight aspect, it wasn't as if they were getting thrashed and then they suddenly one, the lost first 2 fights by interference, not because like you said, oh, these opponents are tough.

I think the problem is, Hiro isn't making enough strong characters, One piece as u pointed out is littered with strong characters, before the time-skip, outside Fairy Tail there were only a hand full of strong characters, the others coming from The Major Dark Guilds, everyone else was pretty much fodder, i think he tried to rectify that after the time skip, by making more guilds than just FT, Lamia Scale and Blue pegasus. and in doing so introduced Sabretooth, and characters like Minerve, Kagura, Chelia, and co. But for me, I think they aren't enough, but he's redeemed himself a little in the last chapter by mentioning those 4 meaning, there is a higher level for people like laxus and erza, to aim for. I also suggested he opened it up by making there more than one continent. It could potentially give him as much diversity as one piece has, but the problem is how to link up the story line.

Its funny how u say, HAdes was the last real villian given that he is actually the last villain lol, unless u wanna consider Minerva a villain

any who i'm done for now Just waiting on the new chapter , If you want that list I'd have to go re-watch most of the main fights. At any rate this fridays fight should be epic & Laxus better not get a cheap easy win like FT has been getting

I've decided to come back to Fanpop. And what better way to announce my return than a rant about what has happened in Fairy Tail over these past few months? Looking over the recent posts, T_ballack and reefa2931 seem to have dominated this forum with their lengthy posts, that normally I would say TL;DR which is also true in this case; I’m not reading through all those pages of long posts that I missed in my absence, but I just want to apologise in advance that this post is really long.

Okay, so the last post I can see that I made was about the future Lucy reveal, not going into any detail, so let’s start there. To be frank, I didn’t like it; but that’s just to do with my personality. Mashima put in so many hints, making it so blaringly obvious and leaving the chance of it being any other existing character completely improbable; and let’s face it, why would there be such a mystery about it if it was going to be someone completely new, there wouldn’t really be much point. Nah, I just don’t like things where virtually all fans predict the same outcome for something that is supposed to be a big mystery, and then it happens.
So now I’ll talk about what else happened during that chapter (312). The fight between Erza, Kagura and Minerva. Despite Mashima’s tendency to make such anticipated fights so short, it was a great battle and I can’t wait to see it in the anime. Three powerful women fighting it out and the first step to understanding what Minerva’s magic truly is, War God magic, a kind of wave-like matter manipulation. (Back to an earlier discussion, more God references).
Moving on. Oh my God, how dare Minerva do that to Milliana. Is that how Sabertooth became the strongest guild? Dirty tricks! Cat-girl fetishes aside, I would personally jump into this manga and give Minerva a piece of my mind; if only that were possible *sigh*. Forcing Erza to fight Kagura and then taking the finishing blow for herself; no matter how tactical, it is still underhanded and despicable; Minerva you dumb b*tch. I hope she gets what’s coming to her. On a side note, at least we get to know where Erza comes from, wonder what happened to her parents, or there is still someone alive from Rosemary Village who knows her real last name.
So next I think I’ll talk about Rogue vs. Gajeel. Good fight, I was personally expecting Gajeel to knock Rogue out on the spot. I didn’t really take much interest in the fight itself, what I really want to talk about is the Iron Shadow Dragon Slayer. Gajeel took Rogue’s ability a little too easily don’t you think? It may seem a better combination of abilities than Natsu’s Fire Lightning, but come on, Rogue was using offensive magic and Gajeel managed to eat it; nothing like when Laxus gave it to Natsu as a power up. Ridiculous.
Now, that mysterious shadow, a potential interesting plot development. But let’s focus on what or who it could be. One possibility I have seen passed around is Zeref, or at least someone related (in “business”, not blood); the main support for this is the shadow’s creepy eye. I would have to deny this as Zeref’s eye is circles and a dot, the shadow on the other hand looking closely is a spiral. I find it unlikely that Zeref will have any reason to specifically target Gajeel. Another possibility is Skiadrum; we have seen Grandeeney as a ball of light, what if Skiadrum is still alive and living in secret as Rogue’s shadow, forever watching over him. Noticing the power gap between them being the reason the shadow/Skiadrum decided to interfere, but with limitations of what he can do in shadow form so Gajeel was still able to beat him. Highly unlikely, just offering another possibility. Another is Raven Tail; we saw the little creature get away so obviously they are not completely gone. Personally I don’t think they would act so soon and that Mashima would save them for a later arc but you can’t deny the possibility that they would really want to get rid of the double agent, the person who has been tricking them for so long. Now my final, random suggestion that leaves this completely open, the Gods of Ishval; what if they are interfering? Mashima could try to work Gajeel into the suspected forthcoming Wizard Saint sub-plot/arc.
Wow, that’s a lot, what else do we have? Ah, what we all “knew” would happen. The Lightning God Slayer, personally I prefer the sound of Thunder God Slayer, but best not to digress. Relating back to my first comments about future Lucy, my hatred of this comes down the predictability of Fairy Tail again. So many fans predicting this… blah, blah, blah. I suppose after more than 300 chapters, we will get a fair share of obviousness, a reasonable amount of content to complain about, but I still don’t like it. One thing I was expecting was an epic, heated battle between Laxus and Orga, ha, Mashima got me there. “POW!!! Right in the kisser!”, a great way to avoid another Dragon vs. God battle; I can’t really imagine it going much differently than Natsu vs. Zancrow, so faith in Mashima restored.
Running out of content to talk about. Gray and Juvia vs. Lyon and Cheria, not interested in this fight, not really interested in the characters actually.
Next, what future Lucy said about the future… 10,000 dragons, seriously? That many? We saw how powerful Acnologia was, he may have been a freakishly strong dragon but I can’t imagine these 10,000 being pushovers, but still, where did they all come from? Expect a time travel arc where when over the characters return to the present bringing a mass of dragons with them; or maybe they were just trying to escape Acnologia in the past and accidently stumbled through Eclipse when the Princess opened it. Whatever the reason, future Lucy is hiding something and I want to know what it is. So far this plot is exciting me, no serious hints and a steady development.
The Gods of Ishval, having touched on them earlier, finally, we will get to find out who the Saints are. Something I have been waiting a while for. The 10 strongest mages on the continent recognised by the Magic Council, as stated a long time ago. 7 years prior, at least 4 of them were residents of Fiore. For those of you who haven’t seen the map of Earthland, there are a lot more countries; I’m surprised that there were so many belonging to Fiore, especially since it is a small country. I also wonder what is going to happen to the plot since Mashima wants to keep the story confined to Fiore. Moving back to the main subject, who are they? Ooba says that they are not human, so naturally “Gods” is the assumptions, living breathing Gods. So many references to Gods. I personally don’t want to think that they are actual gods, immortals at best. That said I want more details on immortals. We all know Zeref is an immortal, and possibly Purehito was considering he was an old man when he passed the guild onto Makarov. Are there many more? How does one become immortal? Several things do give me hope for the future of this manga, but overall this arc has definitely not been my favourite.

To anyone who has actually read all that I wrote here, congratulations, you may not have a life; but don’t worry that’s a good thing. So again I want to apologise for a very long post, also any misspellings that I may have made and also bad grammar that I just couldn’t be bothered to change.

@BakaOnibi, Welcome back dude or girl whichever you are though i suppose it'll be cooler if u were a girl, my reason being it'd be cool to have a girl butting heads in arguments and providing long posts but any sex is okay lol. I wanted to comment on your post but its too random and disjointed :(. Plus it contains stuff i'm not really too interested in the lucy thing. So i'll just comment on some things

The gods from ishval thing, first i think you should understand here that "gods" in this context is something of a figure of speech, I believe she says they are like gods, i expect its something like they are so strong they are considered to be gods, just like zancrow considered Hades a god, or Enel was considered a god. My reason for saying that is, i believer THERE ARE NO ACTUAL gods IN FAIRY TAIL, i say that because, far back as we have been taken in history, Dragons ruled Earthland, meaning they were the strongest beings on it, It was said Dragon Slaying magic was the only way humans could beat them, which was obvious since Dragon slaying Magic comes from Dragons, now this was around 400 years ago i think, prolly long before Fairy Tail was formed, unless mavis was some sort of immortal (given she died in a young looking form), now 400 years ago, i doubt there would have been lost magic(given that lost magic stems from a magic that has been lost through time and is rare), so at the time, there would have been god slayers, now from what ziliconis(or something like that) said, he said humans praticed magic but were mere fodder to dragons(we can understand that given acnologia's feat), meaning we can infer that even god slayers couldn't do anything to dragons, and since Dragon slayer could, then it would mean Dragon slayer magic is stronger, meaning there are no actual gods, or if they are, they are weaker than dragons which would be why dragon slaying magic is stronger than god slaying magic. Personally, i believe god slayer magic IS JUST A NAME. They are counterfeits compared to actual dragon slayers, i say counterfeit because they are also capable of eating elements, i assume it was a magic created by humans to be based off Dragon SLaying magic but isn't actually as good.
I'm also happy that they 4 saints from ishval are gonna be introduced, to be honest i would have preferred if Jura was the 9th strongest saint and makarov was 10th, then we'd have 8 much stronger guys ti go through, meaning people like laxus, erza and mirajane would still have more levels to improve to. I would like to see how these 4 saints compare to Gildartz, i sincerely hope they are at the very least as strong and prove it by feats, but it'd be better if they were much stronger so that we know Gildartz can still improve, Since it seems like Gildartz is the final opponent for Natsu to surpass, i hope Gildartz gets above the SUPER MONSTER LEVEL he is, so that i can be confident to say he CURBSTOMPS WHITEBEARD, GURAGURAGURA XD. At the moment i'd say maybe shanks or whitebeard level ;).

One thing i saw in you explanation, can u give me a link to this "map" of Earthland, and is it official, by that i mean is it canon and done by Hiro, and not something that appears in an OVA. Because i was pretty sure they said wizars saints were as u said 10 strongest mages recognized by the council in the continent, and it was said i think that they were the wizard saints of Fiore, implying that Fiore is the continent, i assumed that Hiro would introduce other continents as time went on, and that they could posibly have their own saints.

I haven't noticed any hint on Minerva having anything to do with god or god magic. u say god reference, they only thing i ever saw was a pic on here, and i assumed it was fan-art. Only thing, minerva keeps mouthing out is Tiger this, Tiger that. On the Minerva method, true she has shown signs of sadism but the methods of fighting i haven't had a problem with, except her taking out Kagura and thats because she didn't beat her. The beating lucy, well, lucy needed it, torturing Milliana, i admit that was bad, but her fighting style i have no problem, going for erza.s injured leg, its smart, or letting Erza, Kagura face off and fighitng the winner, that was just her admitting she couldn't take them on both. If a character on the good side used this methods, we wouldn't have problems, we'd actually laugh, like Nijima in Kenichi and Ganju in Bleach, so i have no qualms.
Here's what i think on Minerva though, I think she is actually not as strong as Erza or Kagura, my reason for saying that is, she used what i believe is one of her stronger attacks hoping to take out both of them and they took it without batting an eye and they both hadn't gotten serious at the time which was followed by her pulling out of the fight, this could be why she fights smart, I think the only thing she has going for her is that her magic is still mysterious at the moment, it hasn't been analysed by erza and figured out, the instant that happens, she loses. Why i think this is, the feats we have seen from Minerva, beating Lucy to a pulp, not much, seeing as anyone at Elfman level could do that, if she didn;t get the chance to call out Loki or capricorn i think (seeing as gemini seems to be too useless for my liking), another feat, and by far the only reasonable feat, was able to deflect an attack from LFD natsu with no visible difficulty, this should be as a result of her magic that allows her to manipulate spacial positions, but not to fall into a NO LIMIT FALLACY trap, it could have a limit, unless we are assuming she could change the spatial position of the earth, so for now, we know the limit is above the LFD, this by feats puts her above current Natsu, who is a few ways from Pre-skip Laxus, so we can assume for now that Minerva is above that level, being kind, we can put her at Pre-skip laxus level as the minimum, so for now we can assume her level to be that until feats show us otherwise, now Pre-timeskip laxus IMO opinion was either a little weaker, equal to or a litlle stronger than makarov , so Minerva for now is at that level, and as i have explained somewhere in this club (can't remember where) Erza has surpassed makarov, and is now stronger than him, so Erza and kagura's level is Above Pre-timeskip laxus, well below preskip Gildartz though but in that quota. So For now, by feats, both Kagura and Erza are a level above Minerva, so until she shows something in the forthcoming chapters, I believe she has to level up to be able to beat Erza, its all good now erza is still fatigued, but like i said, once her powers are analyzed, she'd done for.

Let this be all...................FOR NOW.

welcome back again

Well, I'll start by saying that I'm a guy.

Okay, sorry if what I said seems a bit random, I understand that the term "God" is probably meant figuratively but taking that Ooba said that Jura is the strongest human mage, I think that statement is unnecessary after saying that the four strongest aren't human, whether literal or not. But I don’t really understand the structure of Japanese sentences and it is an unofficial translation, maybe it is less redundant when spoken in Japanese. I agree with you in that I don’t believe there are any actual “Gods”, but there must be something that makes them different, in terms that they cannot be called normal humans hence my question of could they be immortals.
You make the assumption that there were even God Slayers around during the era that Dragons ruled. Personally I would think that across different eras, there were different rulers. God Slayer magic being much more ancient than Dragon Slayer magic, so by the time that the Dragons came around, the Gods were already gone and so too the God Slayers. This making the Gods more of a precursor race than deities. Of course this is all an assumption, but I can’t wait for the first Exceeds that become Human Slayers, lol.

So after these 7 years, you can’t just be happy for Jura, having made it up to 5th? That said, is Makarov still a Saint? After 7 years (well it was 6 and a half years) of being assumed dead, unless another Saint died or was fired(?) recently I think he is going to have to earn his title back.

The image for Earthland can be found on FTWikia, but here is a link for the image:
link
It was included in the Volume 5 Bonus Book of the manga, so yes it is canon. Earthland is the world, but the map is only of a continent. And Fiore is a “small peaceful nation” as said in most episodes of the Season One opening, not the continent. Mashima will probably change it to as you said to, Fiore’s Wizard Saints, just to keep the story within Fiore.

As for Minerva’s magic, she doesn’t say anything about it herself but Mavis recognises it and refers to it as “Yakuma’s Spell of the Eighteen Gods of Battle”. Her magic and fighting style I have no problem with, but her actions/tactics so far have been cheap and cruel and she seems to enjoy making others suffer. I think she has daddy issues.
True, Minerva may not be as strong as she’s hyped up to be, but then have any of the Sabertooth members been that strong? Even if she still doesn’t turn out to be as strong as Erza, I think Minerva is still holding a lot back; so far she seems to be playing games and not taking the fight too seriously. Wait until she gets pushed to the edge and then we may see her true potential.

@BakaOnibi, I think Obaba said something like the 4 saints are sooo strong they could hardly be called human, IMO i think its just that their strength is just sooo ridiculous that calling them human might seem inadequate, probably something like how nami says, Zoro and Sanji can hardly be called human.
The only immortal shown up till now is zeref, hades wasn't immortal, his heart granted him longevity.

You assume there were gods before dragon, its not impossible though, but from what zealconis said, the dragon war started over 400 years ago, meaning well before then they were leaving in peace, if gods existed before then, why did they dissapear or did the dragons kill them before taking power.The thing i base it off on is that a Dragon slayer and a god slayer of equal power were to clash, the dragon slayer mauls the god slayer. Natsu was weaker than zancrow not because of type of magic, but he wasn;t his level yet, which is why, when he ate Zancrow's flames and temporarily became same level with him, he was able to blow him away, and remember Zancrow said there were no actual gods. Exceed become Human slayers?? O.O When did that happen or where was it mentioned, is it because of pantherlily's size?? or is it because of the supposed "mission" to kill the dragon slayers that wendy talked about, i hope u realize that the mission turned out to be fake. I believe when their history was mentioned, it was said that they were so weak humans picked on them.

Oh, you misunderstand me, i am happy for jura honestly, i just thought have 8 guys stronger meant 8 possible levels of improvement and even 8 arcs, which is better than having 4 guys, and yeah, makarov is still a saint, Jura calls to tell him there is a saint meeting, but come to think of it, we don't seem him wearing the saints' robe recently so he might have been removed,

Thanks 4 the link, while it might have been included in the bonus book as a pic, it doesn't make it 100% that it is canon, remember a lot of pics are normally put before and after even manga chapters, but anyways, i have no problem believing it, just wanted to say that it might turn out not to be canon. If it were canon though, from the map, we have no way of knowing that it is only showing a continent, it looks more like it is showing the whole of earthland, and if that is the whole of earthland, then we can assume all those locations are continents, it looks small because the scale of the map doesn't look big enough, another possible proof is that The top 4 saints are from Ishval and, Ishval doesn't show on the map, meaning ishval might be a country in Fiore, by the way i consider Crocus and Magnolia countries.

What mavis recognized as one of yakuma spell was the El dorad or something that she used, that spell alone is the one recognized as the yakuma spell, her normal or base magic is still the mysterious one and so far has no god reference. Like i said, for now, going by her best feat she is not as strong yet, but she could show more, so now its up to Hiro whether she is weaker, on par or even stronger than erza's level.

Okay, fair enough I forgot about Hades’ heart. So one immortal, one pseudo-immortal, and two ethereal beings, if I count correctly.

When does Zancrow say there are no actual Gods? I seem to remember him saying that he was not taught by a God, but that’s not to say that there were never any Gods existing a long time ago. By the way, it’s just a random theory I thought up on the spot while writing the post, but it’s basically that the world is always dominated by a certain race and eventually a weaker race will come along and take over. In the way that some humans have become Dragon Slayers, there could have some Dragons that were God Slayers or of some other older race. In terms of Natsu and Zancrow’s strength, I think it is hard to determine because we don’t know exactly Zancrow’s past experiences or how strong Tenroujima’s protection was.
The Human Slayer thing was just a joke, playing on my theory of the next dominant species being weaker than Humans. The idea of Exceeds killing off the humans was just something random that popped into my head.

The map is clearly not of the entire world. If you look north of the Pergrande Kingdom there is a lot of greyed-out land leading off into nothingness. There are also two more unnamed areas sticking out from behind the clouds, north-east of Fiore and south of Enca. Besides both Bosco and Caelum have both been mentioned in the manga; Bosco is where Bora was taking the kidnapped girls in Chapter 1 and the Tower of Heaven was near the coast of Caelum which is one reason why the Magic Council was hesitant to fire Etherion.
I’m just wondering where you are getting the idea that Magnolia and Crocus are countries. Magnolia has always been a Town, and Crocus is a City. Besides, Crocus is the capital of Fiore, and I’ve never heard of a capital of a continent.
Also, Ishval is not necessarily a country, it could be anything. Just something that they are all associated with.

My argument on Minerva’s strength was really just because it sounded like you were saying that she is definitely weak and doesn’t stand a chance. Me saying god references is really just reminiscing about before I disappeared for 2 months, I think it was somewhere around page 4 of this forum there was a conversation about all the references to Gods that Mashima had put in recently. Now with this alternate name to one of Minerva’s spells and also the Gods of Ishval, doesn’t it seem like Mashima is hinting at something?

Hi BakaOnibi !!! :) Nice to see you again. :) Your English was missed alot. :)

@starprincess7:It's good to know that the thing I'm most remembered by is my English.

Anyway, Chapter 321 is out now (scanlated by MangaPanda, meh, their translations aren't always up to scratch, this one doesn't seem bad though).
I'll start with the thing on Milliana's back. Well highly likely that it is Lector, so looks like Minerva wasn't lying and he's alive.

Now, Jura vs. Laxus. Two freakin' monsters there; a great fight and a satisfying end. So, Jura was supposedly the strongest "human" and Laxus just beat him, I'm kind of hoping that the power gap between Jura and the Gods of Ishval is monstrously monumental. This also leaves me wondering, how strong is Laxus now in comparison to Gildarts; I understand that Gildarts is unlikely to become a Wizard Saint because he likes to go off and do his own thing, but I would have thought Jura as ranked 5th being a decent match up with Gildarts. If Gildarts is still considered much stronger than any other of the Fairy Tail members, would he have been able to destroy the MPF by himself, unlike Cana who borrowed Fairy Glitter? Gah, need an official ranking for gauging characters' strength, not just something like S-Class which can vary from guild to guild. Nevertheless, Fairy Tail is now in the lead for the GMG and with all 5 members left, looks like they are going to win; although according to the Princess and Future Lucy, there is going to be an unexpected victory; to be honest, my bet is placed on it coming down to Sting vs. Fairy Tail and he wipes them all out, ergo a Sabertooth victory.

So... Erza vs. Minerva. Well, we are getting a little more detail about Minerva's magic, as she herself (according to the MangaPanda translation, I prefer the MangaStream translations, not that the meanings are different, at least not usually, I just prefer their choice of words i.e. naming, grammar and spelling) refers to her magic as "spacial magic" (,see a misspelling, it's spatial) and "territory". As said by Arania and Risley, she can change the space and it's properties around her. Even so, looks like Erza's figured it out as T_Ballack said she would, along with now using her Second Origin and a new Armour, looks like a victory in the next chapter.

The last battle, Gray and Juvia vs. Lyon and Cheria. Not much to say on this one for this chapter. Again, I can see a victory for Fairy Tail coming, especially with the "their weak spot is teamwork. We can work together better than them." If any pair can work well together, it's got to be Gray and Juvia.

So this has been a good chapter, Mavis' personality still gets me a bit confused, sometimes she is so wise and collected, whereas other times she's like an adorable little girl. The next chapter is going to being 36 pages and have a colour cover, also will be the climax of the GMG; can't wait.

I was responding yesterday, and when i got towards the end, i accidentally went back and all i had written disappeared, i just lost motivation.

@BakaOnibi, i think i should respond before stuffs on the new chapter and roaring thunder get posted.
Yeah, i agree, but who is the second ethereal being, i only remember Mavis for now.

Zancrow disputes the existence of any other higher power, whether Dragons or gods, what he said was i was trained by Master Hades, who can be likened to a god. Also i don't think races taking over are always weaker, it could be weaker or stronger, but one thing most of the time is, the race that succeeds usually has something over its predecessors, It could be strength, it could be brains, it could be numbers, resilience, adaptability or whatever thing. Lolz at your human slaying Exceed theory.

Zancrow was indeed stronger than natsu until he equalized strength by eating his god flames. He was strong but he just so happened that he had a big mouth, and was full of his power, the idiot called Jellal and Master Zero nobodies lol, when they both could have crushed him, with one hand behind their backs. Fool had his death coming. Tenroujima didn't increase their strength just made it so whatever happened they couldn't die.

The map thing, I don;t think we can just assume its not of the entire world, while that is a possibility that its not of the entire world, it is not an absolute, the scale could be what is making you think that, if u saw the map of the world in a really small scale it might look like this. If you saw this map in lets say scale increased by 1000000 Km/unit, you'd think differently. There are no unnamed areas on this map, Maps use Legends to mark territory, and the legends on this map is done using colour coding, so any land near fiore whether named or unnamed that is coloured bright red is a part of fiore's territory, so once it has been named anywhere(most likely near it) where the colour is seen is the same territory.
I do however, concede to ur point though, while i don't see it as 100% that Fiore is a country, i think its more likely it is a country than a continent, cos like you said Continents don't have capitals, but if it indeed were a country then it could be that there is only one continent on earthland,, and earthland is indeed the continent, but Gildartz already confirmed that there was more than one continent and even zealconis somewhat backed this up, so u see the conundrum i'm facing here, but all this is assuming the map is even canon which we cannot be sure of.

You are right on the Ishval thing, i completely concede, It doesn't have to be a country, there could have been a war at maybe a river called ishval and they were the heroes, or any other event and it associated them with the name Ishval.

I'm not saying Minerva is weak, i'm saying she has shown feats of power only to pre-laxus level, while it is possible that she is stronger than that, we have no way of knowing, as we cannot simply powerscale her to anyone on Kagura's level. I still maintain that once her magic is figured out she gets beaten. She hasn't shown any speed feats, any durablity feats, one of her strongest moves was taken by erza and kagura with almost 0 difficulty. Now that it had been confirmed what her power is, which by the way I CALLED IT A WHILE AGO, once those wave like matter are dodged she can be hit, thats all i wanted to confirm, whether she maipulates space around her or just in the wave like matter, since its the wave like matter, once its dodged like erza did, she can be hit, and since she has no durability or speed feat so far, we don't know how much it will take to bring her down.

@T_Ballack: Yeah, sorry. I should probably be a little more patient. The second ethereal being, well in chronological order he was first, is Roubaul the master of Cait Shelter.

Tenroujima at least increased their stamina, when the tree was uprooted and the protection was gone, most of the members could no longer stand up with their injuries, they were only able to keep fighting because of Tenroujima’s protection.

I still remain firm that the map does not show the entirety of the world. Those grey areas are unnamed and unallocated to the named countries. They are clearly not oceans or clouds, they are definitely other areas of land.

@BakaOnibi, yeah, i forgot about the Cait shelter thing, they were weird, like they could be touched right, anyways ethereal sort of.

Tenroujima doesn't increase their stamina, its just like a magic that stopped them from dying, they could collapse like Gajeel did, and be knocked out, but they wouldnt die. Remember that when the tree was uprooted Freid, Bixlow and Gildartz hadn't taken any hits and they went down. What happened there was the tree has a link/connection sort of to all members that bear the insignia. When azuma took control he sort of used that connection and kind of reverse engineered it to suck out all their magic power and bring them down. and after he was defeated the tree was still down but Fairy Tail were still fighting.

Guess we gonna have to wait and see on the continent/country thing lol.

The thing on Milliana's back, well i never really concerned myself with that, but if i consider it, u might be right in it being lector, considering the shape, but why minerva will bring him back now is beyond me.

Yeah me too, I'm hoping its something really collosal the difference, so the forerunners in Fairy Tail, Laxus, Mirajane and Erza have a chance to improve much more. And the Gildartz thing, lol IMO Gildartz is still stronger than laxus, and yes Gildartz could smash up the MPF easy, without having to use too much power, laxus could too, when i think about it, If laxus Concentrated all the lightning attack from Hall of thunder on the MPF, he would have destroyed it, HAll of Thunder was City level destruction, was gonna destroy all of magnolia. You mention a ranking right, i once made one of what i thought the tiers were, i'll post it again under article section and update it and continue to update along with happenings in the manga.

I posted a way that it could end unbelievable, One is that FAiry Tail finishes with 5 members, that is unbelieveable if u look at it objectively and that is why people don't want it to happen, because they think it should be impossible, The second unbelieavble ending is;

YEah, it does seem the GMG winner might be decided next week, with the remaining 2 battles, one option, Gray and Juvia unison raid Lyon and Chelia, ERza Pawns Minerva, second option, STING ANYONE, he defeats the weakened Fairy tail, anyways i just thought up an unbelievable ending,
Gray and Juvia pawn Lyon and Chelia, FT 58 points,
Erza pawns Minerva FT 63 points,
then sting defeats weakend Erza/Laxus, Gray, Juvia Gajeel, ST 59 points,
then he defeats weakened Laxus/Erza and ST 64 points, edging the GMG

Mavis lol

Hey guys just read the new chapter...

I think all of you know what i am going to say. But it is not what you think. What pissed me off about the Laxus/Jura fight was not that Laxus won, dont get me wrong. It was obvious from the beginning right? But what really annoyed me was that the Laxus/Jura fight is ANOTHER fight that will be added to a long list of short and underwhelming fights in this arc. And I thought Hiro would do it with anyone but Laxus. Whatever, i am DONE with the fights in this tournament. I am not gonna hold out for Hiro to give us a LONG, DRAWN-OUT, WELL-DRAWN, ACTION-PACKED AND LEGIT FIGHT! So i didnt think i would say this but... Im gonna pay attention to the Eclipse side plot and skim the tournament sections. Doesnt really matter because the tournament is almost done and good riddance for that -_-.

P.S: Erza new armor i will admit looked pretty cool ^^, but im still done with the tournament >.>

@T_Ballack: Well to be honest, I'd completely forgotten about Azuma's existence. Nevertheless in Chapter 235 it is said that the Tenrou Tree enhances their magic, not just giving them divine protection.
But yes, the collapsing is probably because Azuma sucking out their magic.

If you look at one of my earlier posts I did mention that I think Sting will defeat all of Team Fairy Tail.

@reefa2931: I have given up on complaining about all of the short fights. I doubt Mashima really wants to write 2-3 chapters for each fight. But the tournament is nearly over so the opportunity has come and gone.

Yeah, i agree, for some reason he seemed to be rushing through with the fights, maybe cos of the eclipse plan. Anywyas seems like the battle part/GMG is finishing next chapter or latest the one after that, so we finally get to the eclipse part :(. I loved that we finally got to see a Secret Dragon slayer art, i was beginning to think the 2nd Gen DS didn't have them, but that must have been one hell of a boom, for it to reduce Jura to almost a skeletal form.

GOOD i'm glad you guys are on my side I agree completely what pissed me off wasn't that Laxus but it was won i'm going to use the term "easily" here. Because it really was AT LEAST Laxus vs Jura should of been AT LEAST another chapter ;-; & Ballakc seems you were right about Minerva's Magic she can compress space some what / the area she's in I believe she breifly mentioned you're theory. Also Sting beating all of fairy tail XD it's been quite clear that sabertooth isn't going to win anything. other than that I really have nothing to say about this chapter other than it pissed me off like every other chapter the only fight i've genuinly enjoyed was Sting & rouge vs Natsu & Gajeel. after that it went down hill. THis fight Laxus vs Jura should of been Catastrophic it should of Leveled the damn town, Every should of ducked & covered like this Fight should of been quite literailly the titans Brawl.

At this point if I were to recommend Fairy Tail to ANYONE as a new manga, I would say read up to where Acnologia destroys the island then STOP and wait for the arc after the GMG. Considering that FT is ending in 2-3 arcs I would drop it right now but there would be no point. I now read FT for fun and I won't take it seriously. I refuse to do so until the writer HIMSELF starts to take it seriously. Am tired of Hiro crapping on paper then releasing it as a chapter. This sh*t has gone downhill from Day 1 of the tournament and it's sickening. I feel bad because Fairy Tail WAS GOOD. I recommended it high and low for new manga readers, so much so they thought it to be my fav manga when it wasn't. I feel so bad for those guys because I recommended a series that has gone for sh*t. And you know people asked me why I still read this crap, and I said that I have faith that Hiro can turn it around. This was about chapter 293. Now I know that this arc is irreparable.

@reefa i read the early chapters, not too sure on the storyline, it isn't too good, its very cheesy and i don't mean that as a pun, but in terms of strength they Far surpass one-piece, i think i heart as of right now, Toriko himself is at mid tier and his feats surpasses all of one-piece, there are casual mountain levelers in the manga, and the way i hear it, it seems like it might have been a manga created just to flaunt strength. But i might be wrong, i only read about 30-40 chapters or so.

WARNING, RANT ALERT!!!!!!
Okay, i have just decided to post this because i want to get my view across to peoplez. First things first. If you fit one of these categories please do not read on:
1) You think that Fairy Tail is a quality series.
2) If you like Natsu Dragneel.
3) If you like Lucy Heartfilia (just because).
4) If you like the friendship power ups.
5) If you like the Nakama speeches.

...

So now the people left reading should fit none of those categories (if you do fit one of them and you are still reading whatever i dont care). Basically- Most recent chapter of Fairy Tail= BULLSHIT. Now let me explain why.
1) Laxus vs Jura. This fight was soooo stupid it was funny in a way that p*ssed me off. Firstly it was too short (ive said this before rye?) but that was not the only issue. Now Jura. That must have been some blow Laxus dealt -sarcasm- because he managed to hit Jura's face sooo hard that it caused severe amnesia to the point where Jura FORGOT MOST OF HIS MOVES. I mean seriously? No earth-bending, no Rumbling Mt.Fuji, no anything???? Wow he raised a small wall and a couple of spikes/pillars. Get out of my face with that crap. Jura can do better and everyone knows it. Tailitards on youtube, millennium forums, manga gate and the obd all say "well Reefa, u just mad dat Jura lost". Nope. Not in the slightest bit. This is FAIRY TAIL. Of course i knew Jura would lose, no matter how hard he tried me and everyone in the universe knew he would lose. But he lost sooooo easily. When you face a difficult opponent you go through steps and measures to try to beat them. You have to push yourself beyond your limits and strive. But here we dont see any thinking, any strategy, any analysing, any cunning, even any COMMON SENSE WHATSOEVER. Now in Fairy Tail it is just punch and kick your opponent until he loses. The only fight with any form of legit strategy was the whole Gray's Ice Make: Unlimited stuffz... Now Laxus just has to shock Jura a couple of times then hit with ROARING THUNDER PUNCH, or whatever the f*ck it was called, and then Jura is all "You bested me..." Ughhhhhhhh. FACE PALM. For shame Jura T^T. And now Laxus is the official Troll of the Fairy Tail guild. Both instances where he was meant to shine he trolled. Simples. Then we have... (-_-)... the QUOTE.
"Oh Natsu what would you say in this situation?"
...
*Equips troll face* "I'M GETTING FIRED UP". T^T Nooooooooooooo!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
In one chapter Hiro Mashima took the unique aspect of Laxus' character and shat all over it. And Laxus in my opinion was the 3rd best character with development after Jellal and Erza and Hiro defiled him. Ughhhhhhhhhhhh.... Of all the people you could quote, he picks NATSU???? Why? Why do this to his character Hiro?

But to be honest with you, the Laxus/Jura shit was not the worst part of le chapter, oh boy it wasnt. Minerva. Firstly Minerva's ability. Basically within her visual range, she can manipulate the properties of the space around a certain THING. So basically what she LOOKS at she can CONTROL.... People. Do you know how hax that is? Do you know the magnitude of that ability? When she see's you, you pretty much LOSE (on some Sharingan shit lol). After a couple of panels of Minerva kickin her ass and ONE panel after Minerva reveals her magic, Erza russhes through "I saw through that". Her big strategy was to blitz and rush Minerva? On a broken ankle? Listen people (T_ballack if you have read this far), NO MATTER WHO YOU ARE, A BROKEN ANKLE IS A BROKEN ANKLE. For example negate Instant transmission and Flight, if you broke Goku's ankle, it wouldnt matter if he went Super Saiyan 3. HE CANT STAND. Understand that. Yet no, this is Fairy Tail so Erza can magically speed blitz and stand on a broken ankle. Okay lets say that she can get up, she blitzes Minerva. So now what Minerva forgot her magic. Erza was IN HER FACE. Let me say this again: "what she LOOKS at she can CONTROL". Erza was in her visual range? No bull shit like she was being rushed because she got an attck in yet Erza dodged that shit, so she COULD use her magic. And people still say im butthurt that Minerva is gonna lose. Like with Jura i knew that Minerva would lose, but not like this. ABSOLUTELY NOT LIKE THIS. Then Erza, "My rage is my guilds rage!" Ughhhhhhh! Nakama power up time!!! She is gonna do this because of her guild and her friends now. I thought Hiro could push Erza's actual RAGE, so her saying you pissed me off so i will kick your ass. But no, it all relates back to THE GUILD. Piss off Hiro. This nakama stuff was good back in the Tower of Heaven arc when Natsu would save Erza because of their friendship. Now it is an EXCUSE. An excuse for FT overcoming foes they shouldnt be overcoming. Oooohh now the Second Origin is released and Hiro again fucks up his own power ladder! Erza did 100 monsters, beat Kagura, blitzed Minerva ALL WITHOUT SECOND ORIGIN. I can safely assume Erza is top 10 strongest in Fairy Tail series. Disagree? Go ahead, it doesnt change what Hiro is implying... The armor looked cool but i was so mad i forgot the name... At the start and middle of the series, Erza was quite a strong character and was SELF-RELIANT. Now its my firends this and my friends that and im like UGHHHHHHHHHHHHH!!!!!!! In the process of this arc alone Hiro has defiled not just Laxus' but Erza's character too!

The best part of the chapter was the Gray/Juvia vs Lyon/Chelia part and that part wasnt even GOOD. We have been stuck with the same info for like 3 chapters in a row: Their teamwork isnt working so we must use Unison Raid (we all know its coming). JUST HURRY UP AND DO IT. Seriously the pacing is horrible.

And that there is my rant about the most recent chapter. Pretty cool huh? Just joking, IM MAD AND 1 INCH CLOSER TO DROPPING FT. Anyhow this was one of those chapters that you either were okay with, cool with or downright hated it. If anyone actually enjoyed this weeks chapter then they really shouldnt have read this far... One final message, Fuck you Hiro Mashima, just fuck you...

P.S.: Excuse my French for this whole rant, im really mad.

^ in Agreement with Reefa this Arc over all was disappointing I mean It seemed that when each Guild was like we have a member that can do this Fairy tail was like "We can one up you". For example I would of loved to of seen MORE of the stronger characters mainly Kagura , Minerva ( mostly a better explaination of her magic ) & Jura. Characters that could of had more potionail like Sting & Rouge also Ogra ( asI am interested in the God slayers ). Alot of the fights could of been almost near defeats for them all. But fairy tail Kept pulling out Random BS from NOW WHERE. this Arc really was terrible I understand what Hiro was trying to do but again he went about it wrong the Plot that & point could of been brought to focus alot better than how he did it as pose to giving Mages from other Guilds such strong titles & Descriptions or even nickname than you think "oh there Stronger than FT , Fairy tail's been out of the game seven years" Than FT just knock's them down like there garbage it just frusterated me as some one who wanted character grwoth Not character's that are gods. I prime example of a proper time skip and i'll argue this until i'm dead was one Piece Luffy trained for two years in those two years he became SO much stronger than his part one self. HOWEVER when faced with his Vallain Hoody he still got some pretty bad injuries , & there was still some very emotional struggles he had to come to terms with as a HUMAN. if Hiro would of showed more human like traits and problems along with the skills that Fairy tail Aquried in there 3 months of training it would of been alot better the only person who only showed some what of good character devolpment was fucking elfman -_-.

Overall : I did enjoy CERTAIN points of this arc but there were so many bad parts in this arc that it kind of over looks the good. Like Sting sounding like a boss and saying "yeah I can take Fairy tail" witch we all knew he couldn't but it would of been nice to see fairy tail get knocked off it's high horse.


That is all =)

Haha so it was the shadow... that I know but that it was also at the same time alterred form of a future Rogue - blow my mind. (I was secretly wishing for Zeref) And of course they are yet to show us ST reacts to FT's victory :( oh well.

Hey guys!
I haven't been here in a while........Ah I hate school -,-
Ok did u read the latest chapter?
Let's start.....
Finally Jellal get up from that rock!!! I started ship Jellal with rock.....
I reallly liked that relatioship between Gajeel and Juvia finally Hiro showed them talking :D
I think after this arc Rogue will join Fairy Tail's guild <3
But for real I don't think that everybody will say to Sting what is going on and why Natsu isn't participating....
Oh well the shadow was Rogue's I thought that it will be about Rogue from chapter's name :D
Haha I think that he is like mix between Sting and him XDDDDDD
But why Hiro draw him like that???
Is that real shadows form?
But then what Jellal saw at that night I think 3rd?Rogue who was Lucy???
Many people was shocked that the man who travelled by time was Rogue..
But from chapter's name u can think that this is Rogue! And chapter's cover......

I just unhhh -FACE EXPLOSION- OI I have no words for this garbage anymore I really don't , Honestly do what you want fair ytail nothing can reedem you now.