Debate
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Debate Resolved: That the "Sex and Sexuality" spot should remain on Fanpop.
106 fans picked: |
I agree
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I disagree
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link.
But you know one to each own.
I just have to say I disagree with this statement. There's a LOT of things one could be a fan of that have no place on Fanpop.
Also, Fanpop's terms of service state that you're not allowed to post content that is pornographic OR sexually explicit in nature. Discussing sex in detail, as some of the picks/forum posts in that spot are encouraging, is considered sexually explicit behavior. Now I don't know if the F4 see it that way or not - that's really their call. But I imagine that's why people feel justified in reporting the spot - they see it as a violation of the terms of service.
I haven't reported the spot and I don't feel strongly enough on this topic to do so - but I do veer to the side of it not belonging on this site.
Which isn't to say that I don't support open discussion about sex. However, there are many, many places around the internet where you're encouraged to talk about sex and share your sexual experiences... but Fanpop isn't one of them.
I feel that by reporting it, this will submit the issue to the Fanpop 4 for them to decide on, themselves. It's their site - it should be their decision.
I haven't done so yet, but I am thinking about it.
For God's sake, at least give the spot a chance. If users start to violate the rules then maybe deletion of the spot should be considered.
You know, asking the F4 to remove this spot at this moment in time would be like asking the F4 to ban johnminh because of his pervy comments ...criminal!
Possibly. The actual terms of service for Fanpop lists content that is "sexually explicit" as being forbidden. Do the F4 consider these frank picks about sex and sexual behaviors to be sexually explicit? Maybe. Maybe not.
"You know, asking the F4 to remove this spot at this moment in time would be like asking the F4 to ban johnminh because of his pervy comments ...criminal!"
There is a BIG difference between John's antics and a spot with picks about whether one masturbates or not. One is called innuendo and is pretty harmless. The other is sexually explicit.
Furthermore, reporting will do nothing more than bring the spot to the F4's attention and let them know that their input is needed. If the spot passes their muster and is okay to leave here... then they'll leave it.
If you're so sure this spot belongs here, then reporting it should make no difference. The F4 will ignore the report if they find nothing wrong with the spot.
And this is aimed at anyone upset at the idea of someone reporting the spot:
Frankly, worrying about the spot getting reported is a sign that you, yourself, are aware this spot is pushing the envelope. If someone said they were going to report the Johnny Depp spot, you would laugh it off. Of course the F4 would ignore a report like that. But a report against this spot? You worry about it because you know it might result in the spot's removal... because you know very well it might not be appropriate.
No water off my back,simply being a bit open-minded.
I made this pick so we could have discussions like this. I have responses but I've already procrastinated enough already. Methinks I should disconnect my internet to avoid temptation!
I'm as open-minded as they come... but I believe there is a place and a time for all things. And I don't think Fanpop should be the place for sex.
Do I think those fanfics are acceptable or appropriate? No.
Do they have anything to do with the topic at hand? No.
Also, a fanfic is fiction. It's an entirely different thing than inviting everyone - including young teenagers - to share their best sexual experiences, fantasies and masturbatory habits online.
Open minded? Hardly!
Contrary to popular belief here, it IS possible to debate a topic without resorting to exclamations of "Bloody hell!" and insulting others. Just an FYI.
I think the comment you were looking to make had to do with the educational merits the spot could provide. As yet, however, I don't really see the spot doing anything more than gossiping about sexual things. Maybe I'm missing all this great education on par with the Planned Parenthood site or something.
At any rate, I won't respond to any more comments like THAT one. If I wanted to FIGHT with people, I would've posted in the Flame War Spot, not the Debate Spot. Speak to me intelligently about your stance on the issue... or leave me alone.
You know, I don't want heated arguments either with you. You and I have been there before and I certainly am not looking for a re-enactment, plus I've gotten to know you a bit and I like you but I have to add that you don't seem very open-minded at all with this issue. You're the one that seems to be getting upset and strongly disagreeing with any user that doesn't see it your way.
Yes, I totally agree with you that there is a place and time for everything. I also agree that Fanpop is not a place for sex. As I've stated in my last post I am not a fan of the spot as such - for two reasons. Number 1 I don't need to add another spot to further fill up my updates and number 2, at my age what I don't already know about sex then I guess isn't worth knowing. I answered this pick by Cinders purely with an objective opinion. It is a very new spot, so far (to the best of my knowledge) no inappropriate content has been submitted so why condemn the spot before it's even properly established? If I see something in said spot that I consider offensive or not complying with the site's rules, I'll be the first to click on that report button.
So far, that spot only has content that can easily be found in any magazine. No, I'm not referring to Playboy or Cosmopolitan. I'm thinking of teenage magazine aimed at young people like Dolly.
EDIT: I've broken my own record ... edited a total of 8 times on the grounds of stupid typos!
This is a common internet action used to make it clear what part of someone's comment one's responding to. Most forums and sites provide a "quote" button to allow you to automatically quote a user's words to make it easier to respond to them. I can only assume you've never wandered too far away from Fanpop, to have not seen this being done. O_o
"And you're actually offended by the phrase bloody hell? Is that considered swearing in your book?"
Exclamations like that really have no place in a logical debate - which is what this spot is for. In spite of what you may think, I'm actually not remotely "fired up" about this topic at all. In a debate, it's important to keep a cool head - not run about shouting and getting bent out of shape XD
In fact, I think this is the point where I will bow out of this "debate" entirely. As "debates" go, this is quite a sham of one.
A debate is a rational and objective discussion between two opposing sides or arguments. Cinders opened the debate for whether the Sex spot should stay or not. I presented an argument for that debate. Since then, it's been attacked by several people who don't seem to know the first thing about debating an issue. No opposing argument was made. A few opposing points were made, but it seems that by responding to these points, I'm being argumentative.
Hello? This is the Debate Spot. The entire purpose of a debate is to argue points. Not argue, mind you - but argue points. If you don't want to debate or argue the points you're making, you shouldn't make them in a spot for debating.
Sorry, Cinders... I know you were probably looking forward to some kind of debate in here, but I think that ship has long since sailed. XD
I know, right? XD I've been through 4-chan invasions.
I think the problem here is that I thought the debate spot was for... debate. It's apparently for ridiculousness, instead. XD My bad!
...which I'm sure will make others here go, "OMG A hypocrite!" But I'm sure you understand the concept of debate for debate's sake... and will understand.
I do think there is some quite good debate here...some little sidetracks cause your such fiery ladies and also because we seemed to have changed the question to should we be reporting the spot rather than deletion but i'll run with that since there seems to be more people agreeing than disagreeing
so far you agreers have the made the points that
-any spot should exist if you a fan of it
I completly disagree with this, i mean look a the letter x spot or what about the toilet paper spot.....yes we have a fan club for toliet paper what does that honestly say about some of the people on fanpop
-it's informative
there are many internet sites out there that have loads of information for anyone on sex, fanpop is not designed as a informative site, it's designed as a fan site
if people want some information or personal advice they can always make a pick or forum in the advice spot
-there's no inappropriate content on the spot
how can there not be inappropriate content on this spot with out it being empty, it's like have a spot called "kissing" and not expecting people to put pictures of kissing. Anything on this spot would probably considered 15+ and this site is 13+
-you should give the spot a chance
again this comes back to the any spot arguement, i wouldn't give the letter "x" a chance because it doesn't belong here
-fanfic on this site is very explicit
well again anything inappropriate in these fan fics should be reported if it's in appropriate it doesn't belong here
-it's teen who need the most information
while i personally agree with this point, i come round to my main point, this is your opinion. Fanpop terms and conditions promise nothing inappropriate for 13 year olds and parents will read that and then decide from that weather they want their kids on here and it's up to each parent to decide what they think is best for their kids not us
if parents then found this spot on fanpop they ban their kids from it or block it with an internet security system and maybe even tell other fellow parents about it giving them the wrong impression of fanpop just based on one tiny spot
and just to repeat some for points that i don't feel have been adressed as throughily as you guys could
-it's a breech of the terms and service
-young girls giving out such personal information could attract unsavory characters as well as just embarrassing the girls themselves
sorry if i seem over organized and pushy but i believe this could be a good debate if we don't take thing personally
oh and as glad as i am to see you back drd please don't try and make me cry
As usual, The Debazon is right (on this point, anyway =P). But you know how Fanpop has the community feel/safe zone thing? Why would you venture out there on another site with freaks & weirdos when you can get the answers you need right here, from people you trust? As for the advice spot... For me, anyway, that seems like more of a place for family/friend problems. From what I've seen, it's mostly younger kids there, as opposed to a more... erm, mature audience in the S&S spot. I wouldn't feel right asking a sex-related question in the advice spot - wouldn't want to corrupt the mind of a young'n. The S&S spot is a better place for this kind of content (plus, most of the fans are no longer corruptible). =P
Maybe we should add a viewer discretion advisory bit in the spot description? ;)
no i get where your coming from on that, that fanpop is a safe place how ever we also get the occasional weirdo on here and on any site you never know who might just be watching it
also there are plenty of reputable sites out there that are welcoming and safe places that also have professional and qualified people giving out advice
@Debs - Have I tooooooold you lately that I loooove you? Seriously, awesome job of actually debating. Thank you for renewing my faith in humanity! :D Props to you.
@Dasm - That's a good idea, the viewer discretion label. It brings to mind the last point I wanted to present to this debate...
Fanpop doesn't have any kind of age restriction protocol. YouTube, LiveJournal, etc - all have age restriction protocols to protect them, legally, from adult material/concepts falling into children's hands. I do worry about how a sex spot might effect Fanpop from a legal standpoint. So long as it remains educational, it probably wouldn't be a problem... However, this is a very fine line to tread.
Now I have to go prop Debs for being awesome. XD
First of all, I would not be averse to placing a warning on the spot.
Second of all, I want to mention that in discussing the spot with its other founding member(s), I voiced concerns about abuse of the spot. Abuse, being things such as inappropriate comments, pornographic material, or immature activity, which seem to be the main concerns of all of you against.
That being said, Fanpop in general has active fans who know when something doesn't belong somewhere. If that happens, inappropriate content will be deleted immediately. That said, I have seen photos and videos very similar in rating posted on other spots where "children" can access them (and by children, I mean 13 year olds).
The content is PG-13 rated. Sometimes, it may push the envelope, but in general, there's content on this spot that does the same thing. Full episodes of R-rated shows (not to mention movies) is posted on this site on a daily basis. Just see the horror movies spot, the Dexter Spot, the Sex in the City spot or the Weeds spot for an example of things kids can access on this site that is far worse than what's already been posted in the S&S spot.
Here is an example of some S&S video content:
link
link
link
link (keep in mind you can also find this in the "Weeds" Spot)
Here is an example of content in other spots:
link in the Debate Spot
link in the Gossip Girl Spot
link in Classic Movies
link
I'm not saying that the above links I've posted are BAD-- On the contrary, I think they should remain where they are. All I'm saying is, they're within the limits of "explicit" and so is the content on the S&S spot.
Therefore, this is NO MORE a breech of terms of services than any Sex and the City episode linked on this site.
As for girls discussing personal things-- This spot was created for questions and answers. If/when young girls say or do inappropriate things ANYWHERE they should be warned (and trust me, this isn't something that's exclusive to the S&S spot). I have seen girls giving out personal information in the form of QUIZ questions in the Fanpop Users spot. If a girl wants to speak privately about sexual issues, she should e-mail a trusted (preferably female) member of the spot, I agree. No one is forced to discuss anything they are uncomfortable with, nor are they forced to share or read any information the spot has to offer. It exists for the people who want/need it as a SAFE PLACE, and it will be policed as a safe place just as every other spot on this site is policed-- by its members.
Also, people seem to neglect the second part of the title-- Sexuality. Which is not the same thing as sex, and should be allowed to be discussed openly.
well putting up a warning about the spot doesn't solve any of the long list of problems i mentioned above, concerned parents won't take any notice of that, it won't change the content that people put on it which yes you can report but ultimately have no control over it (and i'm sure you have all experienced reporting something and it not being deleted for a few days), you also may not view everything and those of you are sensible with the content may not spot it and also if you have to put a warning it about it be expicite then it shouldn't be on fanpop at all as that is as astroasis pointed out a direct breech of terms
again with you second point, it's the same as the fanfic point just because this sort of content gets added to the site doesn't mean it should be there in the first place and while you may think it's PG13 someone else might not
also how is a new member supose to know who is trust worthy and who is not, everything on fanpop is a "take your word for it" basis where as on a specific site about sexual advice there will be staff members on there and such and in some places a comment screening process or anomalous chat rooms, fanpop does at the end of the day describe itself as a social networking site
i did not address the sexuality part as i don't think anyone has a issue with this but i remind you that we already have a sexuality spot, the LBGT spot
And anyway, some would argue that the LGBT spot is immoral and should be taken down because "kids might be exposed to that."
Thus far, people have been cooprating and posting mild content. Is your point that if a movie or show has an explicit sex scene then the whole movie/show should be deleted? In that case, by all means go and delete Sex and the City, because I have seen every episode of that show and an episode doesn't go by without a sex scene including full nudity, nor without the word "fuck" used liberally. Or delete every movie posted in the Horror Movie Spot for explicit violence. Because those two spots have crossed far more lines than we have.
We're just trying to make people feel secure about their sexualities. In fact, I've seen absitance advocates there, people who are waiting for marriage, and who advise other people to wait for at least someone special (myself among them). The quiz questions consist of facts that people should know about sex. It's not about promoting one perspective of sex over another, it's a means of sharing ideas, questions, and mature advice. It has just as much potential to go off base as THIS spot does.
You were right when you said earlier that the internet is full of information about sex-- but which ones are the best, with the best information? There ARE a lot of crazies out there, and a lot of misinformation on the website. We serve to correct that misinformation.
We are no more explicit in our conversations than your middle school health class.
Pardon my quoting things, but it really does make things easier... ^_^;;
Cinders said, "It exists for the people who want/need it as a SAFE PLACE, and it will be policed as a safe place just as every other spot on this site is policed-- by its members."
I don't think that ANY site on the internet can - or should - be considered "safe" for anything. However, I do get what you're saying about the spot being safer than some other places. Although I do think there are MUCH safer places than Fanpop. Take a LiveJournal community, for instance. It can be age-locked to keep very young kids out - and also member-locked so that only approved members can read what is said. For instance, a 16-year-old girl posts in a closed LJ community about masturbation - it goes no further than that community. A girl posts about it on Fanpop and it can be read by ANYONE and everyone on the internet - and even indexed by search engines. That, in my opinion, makes the Fanpop spot a pretty unwise (if not downright unsafe) place to discuss sex.
Cinders said, "If a girl wants to speak privately about sexual issues, she should e-mail a trusted (preferably female) member of the spot, I agree."
I could not disagree with this statement more. NO teenagers on Fanpop should EVER be encouraged to e-mail Fanpop members for advice on sexual matters. Okay, you and I both know we're not creepy old men or anything... but what if someone out there is? Predators often go to GREAT lengths to create fake personas to give young people a sense of safety precisely so they will open up to them about sexual matters. So yes, you might know you're safe... but should you be encouraging young people to e-mail someone THEY can't be certain about? For instance, you might encourage them to e-mail you... they have a positive experience with you. All's well and good. But maybe next time someone invites them to e-mail to discuss their sexual issues, they'll be more likely to do so considering how their first experience turned out - and maybe it WON'T turn out so well.
I fear I've done a bad job of explaining my concerns there, but I hope you guys can gather my meaning. I believe kids should ALWAYS be directed to authenticated and credible sources for help and advice of a sexual nature - and ALWAYS encouraged NOT to be so open with strangers online.
Cinders also said, "The quiz questions consist of facts that people should know about sex."
I do have to say that I applaud the quiz questions. Now THAT is truly an educational aspect of the spot, and I can see it being very helpful. Of course, it could go downhill if people start adding weird/wrong information...
Cinders also said, "We're just trying to make people feel secure about their sexualities."
I think the problem here is that we ALL can agree that this is a wonderful notion and a great idea. I certainly applaud the effort to do this. I think the question arises merely from the concept of, "Is this what Fanpop is for? Is this a proper use of Fanpop's resources?" I think that's what resides at the heart of this debate, more so than the merits of educating kids and/or discussing sex and sexuality openly. Less of, "Does this belong?" and more of "Does this belong HERE?"
yes there are alot of teens on this site that shouldn't know these things, but they do, so Its better that they learn some things that could possibly prevent "teenage stupidity" on subjects that could/couldn't be considered poor taste.
Now granted, I do fear that the prowling weirdos of the internet may eventually stumble across said spot an exploit the hell out of it with all their disturbing habits, if this happens I think there should be a BAN policy (if it dosen't exist already) for any potential online predaters, no matter what spot their in.
To me, Its very simple if your someone who is not comfortable with the content being discussed, simply don't visit the spot.
And a young teenager willing to talk about sex in an open forum on Fanpop might as well have a bullseye on their forehead. I mean, you won't need to work hard to "gain their trust" if they're willing to talk sex with everyone and anyone to begin with. Might as well put a post-it on their username that says "I'm easy prey."
I'm not a prude by any stretch of the imagination and I think I'm pretty open-minded but this spot has gone too far. My main concern is the fact that most of the users participating in the Sexuality spot are very young and opening themselves to anyone at all. Not everyone is good and decent, there a lot of evil child predators out there. The users' profiles on Fanpop are not private (such as the Bebo users under 18 which have that option) therefore as astroasis said just above they are indeed "easy prey" for anyone at all.
I think it is so sad that a young person has the need to go on the net to ask for sexual advice. I really do not believe that any user on this site should be giving out that kind of advice. This is not exactly a Dear Doctor page in a teen magazine - it is a fansite viewable by millions of people worldwide that we know nothing about.
I'm not really calling for the spot to be deleted as I know when Cinders created it it was with the best of intention. I do think the Sexuality spot should have moderators though. If that can't be arranged and content cannot be moderated and viewed as to what should and should not be discussed on the site then I do think the spot is better to be removed.
Sorry Carly,I totally supported the spot in the beginning. Now, I see it as a dangerous playground.
to be honest if your against the spot then how do you know it exists and know so much about it!! your probally either a fan of it or have managed to look at it long enough to know!!
Unfortunately,as I have explained in my last post, I now view this spot very differently.
Please see my first comments at the beginning of this pick/discussion to see what I mean.
All that post needs is to be cleaned up a little, take out the details. I did mention in the soapbox that if experiences were to be described, they had to be vague and technical, with no feelings in them. But otherwise, there are several good link, we helped link, information on link, debunking link, and some cute and quirky ways to link.
Like any good sex-ed class, the spot promotes abstinence as an ideal, but recognizes that the ideal is not always the reality, and acts accordingly. The fact that younger people are there speaks more about society's urge to shove the issue of sex under a rock and not talk about it with youth. I do agree that these kids should be careful of the things they say, but I've seen explicit things said by preteens on other spots too, so I don't think this spot is any different.
And like ineedcoffee pointed out, abusers are more likely to troll the Twilight or High School Musical spots for bait more than anything else.
EDIT: I would also like to state that I would not be against extra moderators or a particularly hard eye on the spot. But so far, I think instances of impropriety are few and far between. My favorite euphemism thus far is the pictures of bananas for the circumcision pick. It was cute and classy.
However, I think it should be closely monitored. If very young people are posting, it's not very good. I am not asking to ban, but if you see something that is very inapropreate, report it.
But you can date and i'm free.
But rather than spot removal, why don't we advocate for spot policing. You each mention instances when the spot has gone too far. When I see such instances, I report the offensive content immediately. I urge you to report any inappropriate content you see.
Miss Bev... As you probably haven't been following the debate, one of the top purposes of the spot is to educate confused users on abstinance and, should that fail, safe-sex practices. Think of it as a giant health class.
Also, please refrain from asking out another user in public (or private, for that matter). The other user may find the attention unwanted. Also, I highly discourage dating anyone over the internet. It's much too dangerous.
I haven't been on that spot much myself as I don't really have an interest in sexuality. But I don't want to police anyone's right to discuss it. That's why I don't have a problem with the spot. But yeah I don't know what it's like on there anymore. Last I checked it, it was handled maturely.
IMO if people really want to get sex ed, they can easily go to a health/ wellness website.
Are sex/sexuality/human bodily functions so icky or distasteful that we can't have a fanpop spot on them?
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