i sorta get why they did it but i hate it anyway i think they did it completley wrong they coulda figured something else out

I hated it, but understood it.

i kinda get it but still it was well harsh.

I get they were all needing a break from eachother and such... I think they were just all stressed so I understand in that area... but it still sucked big time!

No. It was out rite betrayal. They where her friends and they had followed her for years and lets face it she'd been great - hadn't she??? Stopped MANY "end of days" from happening and killed TONS of demons!! She is THE slayer which automatically made her the leader.

And guess what!!??? She was elected leader BY THE UNIVERSE! NOT BY THEM!!!! They had NO RITE to decide she was out!

As much as Buffy was/is NOT my favourite character you CANNOT throw out the leader when you start to get unhappy with their orders - it doesn't work that way!!!!!


AND kicking her out of the house???? WTF was that about it was Buffy's freaken house!!!!

They totally deserved to fail because of what they did to Buffy and i was amazed she took them back so easily once their stupid plan fell on it's head! She was totally hero-like about it!

I can tell yah had that have been me i would have bitch slapped their ungrateful bitch asses around the place before chucking them out of MY house! THEN BEFORE taking them back i would have make them listen to hours of endless "i told you so's!!!"

Cause....she was rite - they DID need the axe - she told them but they didn't listen and instead decided that they could do it better without her....THEN they failed....miserably!

totally agree

you know what SG1-090 you're very right and totally awesum i agree with everything you just said but iget why they did it i just think they coulda come up with a better solution such as NOT kicking her out and not ambushing her maybe talking to her for a little bit coz when they were doing that buffy said she was willing to talk bout it god they sould just listen her

Although I understand their reasoning, it was a flawed decision. I don't think they really thought it through or had any concept of what it means to be a leader. They turned on Buffy because they were scared and desperate and, quite frankly, stupid. My biggest problem with that whole arc, is the fact that it was never really resolved. Buffy just comes back and takes over again- no apology from the Potentials or Scoobies, no admitting that they were wrong, etc. They don't even really acknowledge that it happened in any real fashion.

I can't deny I would have my doubts about following Buffy if I was in the position the Scoobies were in. However, kicking her out of her own house was absolutely ridiculous. In a way, she brought the mutiny on herself, because if she wasn't so high-handed and deigned to actually act human once in a while, everyone might have been more likely to follow her. They were fighting a losing battle and everyone was terrified, but she showed no sympathy whatsoever. Those people were her friends, not military cadets, and she was wrong to snap orders and just expect them to follow without questions or concerns. The Scoobies had a right to protest, but I think they completely went about it the wrong way.

hello !
she was the vampire slayer .
she didn't deserve to get treated so bad , she was trying her best . (but we wouldn't have got that beautiful speach off spike if they haden't kicked her out i suppose)

I completely agree that Buffy deserved better and I like to blame it on a few things;

1. Kennedy and Faith. While Faith may not be looking for the leadership role she still wants to be good, and in a way, she wants to be Buffy. Faith has always wanted to be the one that was good, kind, wanted, and special and while she is in many ways she always is the number two to Buffy. On Kennedy, she, to me, is just too full with herself. She hooks up with Willow and suddenly she is above the other Potentials? By removing Buffy from the home she falls into Slayer position number two (as Faith moves up) and the person with whom she disagrees the most is removed.

2. Trust Issues. The main reason for distrust concerning Buffy is Spike. Our blue eyed blond is a great matter of contention. The potenials, while they seem fine with him, must be on some level, afraid of him or feel that he should be put down. Buffy herself has issues accepting Angel fully after she has already developed major feelings for him and the growth to accept Spike also takes time. I do not recall if the chip removal was at all shared but this would make others even more fearful and the threat of Spike seem more lilkely. Buffy though, refuses to dust him or let him be dusted, instead she protects him and not only allows one of her fighters to be pummeled by Spike but goes as far as to threaten Robin. This issue of distrust with Spike was also planted with the trigger. He is a live wire that Buffy protects.

3. Dissassociation and disconnection. Buffy does not know her troops save the core Scoobies. She even admits to it, saying she doesn't want to know them because a good chunk of them will die. I'm not saying that you have to be best buddies with your leader but when the person who is leading you fails to acknowledge you and is standoffish, you aren't fighting for them and being inspired. You are fighting for yourself.

3. Fear. All of these girls are in a new place with some mighty big burdens placed squarely on their shoulders. They know they might die, it's actually kind of likely and they are afraid. When you are afraid you want to blame your issue on others and go into fight or flight mode. They can't run away, it doesn't work; so they lash out at the easiest individual to blame. Buffy. She is "The" Slayer (meaning the first called and most experienced, also in a leadership role), and she is alive while they are dying off. They don't see that she is making tough decisions, they don't have any recollection of the Master or Angelus, Glory or Adam, they just see that in this new world to them, where she is the symbol of their path, everything kind of sucks.

I know this seems to be more of a Potenials only issue and fails to address the Scoobies (who back the decision) but here is my reasoning for them.

Giles - Giles believes in Buffy and he trusts her but he does not approve of her treatment of the Potentials and still feels Spike is an issue. I believe the time off, from Giles POV would serve as a way to help her adjust and take things more into focus from their POV.

Willow - Willow I believe is somewhat manupliated by Kennedy. Following Tara, Willow does not want to lose another lover. It is never said or really implied but the bullet that took out Tara was meant for Buffy, would Buffy's foolhardyness bring about the death of Kennedy for something that isn't even there? Willow's betryal stings perhaps the most (after Dawn maybe) and it is motivated by fear.

Xander. Having lost an eye he is now siding with his pal caution and doesn't want to take anymore risks. While Buffy jumps in headfirst he wants to go slower and that is not her style. Fear is also his motivation.

Anya. Anya sees things very clearly and without the uselessness of tact. What Anya sees is Buffy snapping orders and treating the others like her own personal military without taking into account their thoughts and objections.

Dawn. On the Dawn matter I am not sure how to pinpoint her except with the thought that she doesn't want others to die. She wants to talk it out, she is tired of sacrifice. The last time Buffy went into headfirst into a battle this side she was left alone with Spike and the Scoobies but now Buffy is risking all of it. Perhaps Dawn thinks Buffy will back down and let it all air out?

To sum up this lengthy and repetative rant; It was wrong, from first to last it was just all degress of wrongness but I can, if I step back, see where they were coming from. It wasn't a good or noble place, it was the little demon that, when pictured in actual size is very tiny, but in our minds a giant, Fear. A combination of fear, distrust, and ananomity bring about the confrontation and the entire evilness of that scene.

Agree with your entire post Arabella.

erm no buffy saved their lives loads of times n she is the slayer so its up 2 her how she fights her battles not them n its a gd job she did go coz they did need the axe tht buffy found i new they would lol.
i hated it they were all horrible i wasnt a fan of the scoobies in this episode lol n dawn how very dare she lol buffy is the oldest so its buffy house lol n buffy has lived in tht house since season 1 unlike dawn only from season 5 lol.
ive finished now i think i could go on but i dnt think i should lol

But Arabella because Buffy is the leader and because they where fighting the FIRST she didn't have time to go around with everyone one on one and convince them to trust her again! She is the leader - always has been and it doesn't matter if your scared, they DIDNT have to fight BUT they knew what was at stake - the world - they CHOOSE to fight. AND when they did that they did it knowing who they where following - Buffy! She is the UNDISPUTED(sp?) leader and when they choose to fight they knew she was in charge!

To be honest i was MORE annoyed with the original scoobies - all Buffy has ever done for 7 years is help stop the end of the world - with their HELP....BUT that's just it HELP they have never been the boss and they knew if they disagree - TOO BAD. Buffy was the one who came up with the plans and in the end Buffy was the one to fight the big bad demons.

Where Buffy only treated the girls "badly" because she had too Kennedy did it as well but more because she liked being in charge! I can remember one scene where she calls the girl who kills herself maggot - then is all happy like "OMG i just called that girl maggot!"
So for her to turn around and be all "whine whine blah blah" to Buffy is just fucking unbelievable!

I guess i'm trying to say....i know they where scared but that doesn't matter, they chose to fight and Buffy was the one who leads the people who fight...they never had a choice about that. AND the fact that they thought they did just makes me want to stab them all!

they just needed someone to blame and buffy was the easiest! thats how i saw it anyway!

SGI, I agree 100% that the time did not exist and I fully back Buffy and stand firmly against the Scoobies/Potentials (also know as the Betrayers in this case) but I can see how they would arrive at such a decision. It was wrong, it was an insult to everything Buffy has ever done for them, but I understand why they might have felt that way.

On a side note, I would like to join you in the Potentials stabbing. I feel that while they worked for the show's main message of sharing power and women empowerment they took away from our core group of characters that we have spent seven years becoming attached to.

i don't agree with it, and i don't really like it, but if it hadn't happened there would be no spike speech or spuffy cuddling! *squeal* squeal* squeal*

Touched did come about from it so I also could be somewhat blinded by future scene loveage.

I get it.
Everyone just needed to get rid of Buffy because they thought she was bad in the leadership department.
But they figuered out that when their 'friend' Faith was put in the leadership role, she turned from friend to in charge.
And all the potentials, scoobies, etc. saw that Faith and Buffy have a similar way of being boss. And in war you have to die and to do that you have to take risks and risk peoples lives.
Then everybody figured out that Buffy didn't suck so much at being boss. xo

It's complete bullshit, especially from the original scoobies, she'd been their leader for 7 years and had proven to be a true leader again and again and she'd saved the lives of a number of the potentials and then suddenly they come out with this shit about her not being good enough? Made me so angry.