i know what you mean, i am a huge cangel fan and when i was watching angel it feels more grown up than buffy and i like bangel but after angel left in season 3 and then angel started i didnt care because angel changed i i like the change, i like on buffy his character was a little boring.

I always thought they turn into two different people when around each other, they turn into people that aren't themselves.

Just look at Chosen. Angel just signed away his son's and team's memories, his son had just tried to kill himself, and the woman he was in love with is in a coma and may never wake up and he's really complaining that Buffy has a new boyfriend? He was pod!Angel in that scene.

And that cookie speech? Buffy turns into a twelve year old when he's around. They needed to get away from each other cause their characters needed to grow. DB said that if Buffy and Angel stayed together there would have been no growth for the characters, and that them getting back together wouldn't even work.

Buffy and Angel are two completely different people around each other than others, they don't even show each other their real selves. Part of the reason I don't like Bangel.

But when they are near each other Angel turns into a puppy dog content to get kicked around, and Buffy turns into a whiny little brat. Or at least that's how I see it.

Angel is so much of a better character on Angel than on Buffy, he actually has a personality and is his own person, and when he got together with Cordelia he was still Angel, not some bland, watered down version like when he's around Buffy.

David Boreanaz: When people say they wish [Buffy and Angel] were still together, I tell them if that were the case there wouldn't be any growth for both characters.

He's completely right with that. Buffy had grown into a mature, confident woman by season seven and two seconds around Angel she's regressed back to the same insecure little girl she was at 16. And Angel has gone completely weird, acting like a jealous cavemen when his whole world has just been stripped away from him.

That is exactly how I feel. You just put in much better words than i did:)

ha ha ha nika joker or mkena is gona come with some serious come back for that you better get ready lol

but i completley agree with david characters are much more interesting when they have relationship changes, buffy and angel will probably carry on changing in the comics after cangel and spuffy

yeah but when you love someone so much and you never get to see them, when they do turn up you do turn into a babbling idiot no matter whats just happened in your life, thats why i love bangel, and its their first love its the one noone forgets! i am hoping that joker tisha or scififan can come back with somehting alot better than this! lol!

But it's true, they don't act like themselves around each other, and people change and grow all the time. Some of your friends you've had for years when your a kid your grown apart from because you are two different people from when you were, or sometimes people you didn't get along with end up being your best friends when your older. People who marry divorce because the person they married is no longer the person they fell in love with.

Abscene doesn't make the heart grow fonder, it distances people, it changes people. Love isn't something that is always going to be there, love is something you have to work at every day.

And no, no one forget's their first love, but they do move on from their first love, and they love someone deeper, more mature, and just as true. They move on to a different love, a stronger one, just like Buffy moved on to Spike, and Angel moved on to Cordelia.

Buffy and Angel didn't wholly know or accept one another. Angel tells Buffy that she doesn't know him anymore, and Buffy says she doesn't trust him, and as she's mentioned before, she can't love without trust.

At least, that's how I see it. I know you Bangel's see the relationship differently, but I can't. But I also really don't feel like getting into a Spuffy vs. Bangel fight today either. So I don't think I'm coming back to this forum today, lol.

yeah weve argued way too much other this! lol!